Re: Struggling with Thunderbolt on a NUC8i7HVK

DLawr7 · ‎06-17-2020

(Apologies if this belongs in the Intel® NUC: BIOS and Drivers Issues section.)

I can't get my eGPU going. Here are the components I'm dealing with, all brand new:

NUC8i7HVK (32GB/1TB running Windows 10 Pro version 1903)
Razer X Chroma enclosure
Sapphire Radeon Nitro+ Rx 5700 Xt

Windows Update is completely up to date. Intel Driver and Support Assistant is completely to to date. Microsoft Store is completely up to date. Thunderbolt is definitely enabled in the BIOS. Specific versions of every relevant driver and program will happily be provided if desired.

The symptom of the problem is that when I connect the Razer to the NUC, the enclosure itself is seen by the OS but the running graphics card inside is not. Another strange symptom that might lend a clue is that when I first connected a USB-A thumb drive to the Razer it was seen by the system, but then I pulled it (without a formal eject) and now the system won't see it--it won't even see it if I plug it into the front USB-A port directly on the NUC, suggesting USB is now somehow confused. The thumb drive is still fine though; it works as expected if I plug it into another Windows laptop.

Here are various resources I used in trying to make things work:

1 directed me to 2, and unfortunately the directions at 2 just do not work for my NUC. Uninstalling the Thunderbolt app that I got from the Microsoft Store, the only Thunderbolt software that I can apparently uninstall, did not cause any devices to show an error in Device Manager. (And to be clear, no devices at all were showing errors before, either.) Even with Show Hidden Devices enabled in Device Manager, there is no section called Other Devices and I cannot find a Base System Driver in any other section. I cannot therefor do steps 4 through 9 as instructed.

However, if I compare the contents of the .inf files in the downloaded archive, I see that the TbHostController.inf DriverVer = 11/20/2019,1.41.769.0 matches what is in Device Driver under System Devices -> ThunderboltTM Controller - 15D2. Similarly, TbtHostControllerHsaComponent.inf has the same DriverVer and matches under Device Manager's Software Components section. I cannot, however, find a device in Device Manager that corresponds to TbtP2pNdisDrv.inf. (And remember, IDSA is reporting that Thunderbolt is up to date.)

So maybe my problem is with a missing TbtP2pNdisDrv, but I try the other steps. I reinstall Thunderbolt Control Center from the Microsoft Store and the Razer shows as connected.

The Troubleshooting page next directs me to the USB Type C Power Delivery Controller page, where it says the file "Installs the USB Type C Power Delivery Controller for Windows® 10 64-bit for the Intel® NUC." Except it doesn't really, and doesn't provide any instructions about how to do so. In Device Manager I cannot find the device it covers, either by the descriptive name "USB Type C Power Delivery Controller" (or something similar) or by the part name referenced in the driver files, TPS6598x or TPS65982. Under what section in the Device Manager would I expect to find this device?

So maybe my problem is with the missing TPS6598x, but I try the other steps.

Moving on to the firmware page, I follow the PDF user guide there and, with my Razer still connected as per the guide, I run FwUpdateTool.exe. The Note box says that I "will see a series of dialog boxes alerting you that a registry edit is required for the Update Tool to run properly." I instead get an error box, "Error: 0x208 SDK_SERVICE_NOT_FOUND Thunderbolt(TM) service doesn't exist." According to Firmware Updates Available for Thunderbolt™ on Intel® NUC Products, that means I need to "Install the latest Thunderbolt Bus Driver for your Intel NUC, available on Download Center," basically sending me back to the beginning of this journey.

I'm really surprised at how hard this is. :( Your expert guidance would be very much appreciated.

TDean · ‎06-17-2020

I can only see the Base System Device driver entry in device manager if I do view devices by container, show hidden devices

DLawr7 · ‎06-18-2020

Thanks for the tip! Also a user on reddit shared what his system looks like via screenshots uploaded to https://imgur.com/a/Nnf3pzy and what I have is mostly the same, but for the firmware version.

Sebastian_M_Intel · ‎06-18-2020

Hello DLawr7,

Thank you for posting on the Intel® communities.

In order to better assist you, please provide the following:

1. Run the Intel® System Support Utility (Intel® SSU) and attach the report generated:

Open the application, check the "Everything" box, and click on "Scan" to see the system and device information. By default, Intel® SSU will take you to the "Summary View".
Click on the menu where it says "Summary" to change to "Detailed View".
To save your scan, click on "Next", then "Save".
Use the paperclip icon to attach the report to the thread. Please note that only one file can be attached at a time.

2. Have you been able to test the eGPU card/enclosure on a different system to ensure it is in good working condition?

3. Have you tried ensuring the latest eGPU firmware and drivers are installed?

4. Set the Power Mode in NUC BIOS to High Performance:

Press F2 to access the BIOS -> Advanced -> Power -> Check "Max Performance Enabled"

5. Switch off PCI Link Power Management in Windows Power Settings:

Under Setting (no battery) or On battery and Plugged in, open the drop-down menu, select Off, and click/tap on OK.

Regards,

Sebastian M.

Intel Customer Support Technician.

DLawr7 · ‎06-19-2020

Thank you for your reply, Sebastian.

I've attached the most recent scan. (For anyone else who encounters this thread when trying to figure out how to attach something here, you have to first go to your profile page and upload the file there. Then it will be visible for attachment here.)
I had not tested with another computer before your message, but now I have. I plugged it in to my Macbook Pro and it all just worked, no hassle.
Yes, the enclosure is current. The Radeon 5700 drivers are maybe not, but since the device is not detected I can't use the usual AMD tool to see and update them.
I checked the BIOS and Max Performance Enabled was already set.
This was not off, but now is, and the GPU is still not seen. I found it under Control Panel -> Power Options -> Change Plan Settings (for Balanced, the in-use plan) -> Change Advanced Power Settings -> PCI Express -> Link State Power Management, and changed it from Maximum Power Savings to Off. It didn't trigger anything when applied, and I rebooted and the 5700 still doesn't show up under Device Manager -> Display Adapters.

Incidentally, the USB-A thumb drive is now showing up again in one of the NUC's onboard ports and also in one of the enclosure ports.

Sebastian_M_Intel · ‎06-19-2020

Hello DLawr7,

Thank you for your reply, please check our recommendations below:

I can see that you have the Windows* version: "10.0.18362 Build 18362", can you try to upgrade the Windows* to the latest version? Follow this link for Microsoft's support.
Also, I understand that the system does not detect the device to use AMD's tool, but can you try to do a manual installation? I found the drivers page of Sapphire here, which guided me here for the downloads, please check with AMD for more information on how to update the driver.

Note: Links to third-party sites and references to third-party trademarks are provided for convenience and illustrative purposes only. Unless explicitly stated, Intel® is not responsible for the contents of such links, and no third-party endorsement of Intel or any of its products is implied.

Regards,

Sebastian M.

Intel Customer Support Technician.

DLawr7 · ‎06-19-2020

Definite progress has been made, but I have to leave my office now and won't be able to followup with more detail until Monday. In short, with upgrading to the advance Windows version (which was not available in Windows Update for me) and using the full installer from AMD and not just the stub installer that AMD's site had previously given me, the 5700 device is now visible and working. (I'll provide some more details on that later for the benefit of anyone else struggling.)

In playing with it for just a few minutes though the setup isn't quite working the way I want it to. My goal is to be able to work easily in two different locations, where I just bring the NUC between them, attach the power cable and the Thunderbolt cable, and it all just boots right up into the display/keyboard/mouse attached via the Thunderbolt connection. Yet at first try with booting when the onboard graphics is disconnected, the monitor does go to the right input source of the cable from the eGPU, but doesn't show anything.

Maybe this is just a matter of playing around with display settings, since to get to this point the system had though the onboard graphics was the primary display and once the eGPU was connected it called that Display 2. (And as Display 2 it was slightly wonky, because the system fairly reasonably believed that two separate monitors were involved, rather than me just swapping the input channel on one monitor.) I haven't had much time to play with it yet but am hoping that it is something relative simple like that. If you have thoughts on how to resolve it, I'll try on Monday.

Thank you very much for your help so far.

DLawr7 · ‎06-19-2020

By the way, feel free to call me Dave. Only my mom calls me DLawr7. :D :D

DLawr7 · ‎06-19-2020

Ugh I spoke too soon, apparently that reboot I described with only the eGPU connect where the screen was black was maybe because the device driver just didn't load. Everything is up to date, including AMD's driver. Another reboot (while both the eGPU and the onboard GPU are connected) still shows the 5700 device with an error. Rebooting with only the onboard connected but then plugging in the Thunderbolt cable gives the same error.

The device panel for the 5700 says:

This device is not working properly because Windows cannot load the drivers required for this device. (Code 31)
 
The I/O device is configured incorrectly or the configuration parameters to the driver are incorrect.

How very frustrating when it had worked just prior to the reboot.

Sebastian_M_Intel · ‎06-20-2020

Hello DLawr7,

Due to the policies of this community, we only use the username given as a reference.

Thank you very much for all the details provided, please let us review this behavior internally, I will update on this thread once we have an update.

Regards,

Sebastian M.

Intel Customer Support Technician.

DLawr7 · ‎06-22-2020

I walked in to my office this morning brimming with hope and excitement that I thought my problem was finally solved. Instead now things are worse than ever and I am crushed by despair and agonizing frustration.

I brought the NUC home on Friday to keep fiddling with it on the Core X Chroma I got for home. There I finally achieved success! Here is what I did.

Went to the entry for the 5700 in Device Manager, the one showing the "device is configured incorrectly" message mentioned above, and did Uninstall Device
Tried replugging the enclosure to see if that made anything trigger. Apart from creating a busted "Microsoft Basic Display Adapter Entry" that was flagged as busted, nothing.
With the enclosure connected, tried to figure out how to get AMD's Adrenalin software to just install a driver but ultimately failed. Apparently it can't do that.
Went to the Microsoft Basic Display Adapter and picked Update Driver, and instead of doing "search automatically" used "browse my computer" and pointed it to the C:\AMD directory that Adrenalin had installed. Success! After it was done installing, there was the 5700 device in the manager again, and an instruction to reboot. I did.
When the machine was back up, the 5700 device had no errors but the onboard GPU was showing an error about not being the device at POST or something. I wasn't sure how much to care, especially as I didn't intend to use it long term anyway.
I went to the Display settings and changed it from Extend to Duplicate.
Using the monitor's controls, I switched the input from HDMI (the onboard gpu) to DisplayPort (the enclosure). The DP desktop was exactly as I'd expect it to be, but would it survive another reboot?
I shutdown the NUC and disconnected the HDMI cable from it, then rebooted.
VICTORY! The NUC came up normally and the video was working! One last test, after another shutdown.
The monitor's USB hub had been running the keyboard and mouse via the patch cable from the NUC to the monitor. I moved the NUC end of that to the enclosure and rebooted.
VICTORY 2! Everything was working just as desired and expected. With only the power and Thunderbolt cables connected to the NUC itself, I had a functioning system.

So that should be the end of it, right? I'd bring it back to my office and everything would just work, right? No, you already know it's much much worse than that.

Got to office, plugged in Thunderbolt cable and power cable. Booted.
Screen auto-switches to the DisplayPort input and stays powered like it has a signal but I see nothing on it. Grumble.
I connect the HDMI cable while it's all still booted, but this provides no image on the HDMI input so I reboot (with the Thunderbolt still connected)
Still no image. Shutdown (via long press), disconnect Thunderbolt, reboot.
YAY an image via HDMI! I can log in!
With Device Manager up, I plug in the enclosure and the 5700 shows up with no errors. Yay, that's promising!
Apparently *this* enclosure/gpu is considered to be a different device from *that* enclosure/gpu, because in Display settings it is at the default to extend the displays. Totally makes sense actually, and seemingly easy to address. Whew. All I have to do is set it to Duplicate and everything should be good, right? RIGHT?? Set it, shut down, disconnected HDMI, rebooted.
*(@#)$@*)#(@*#(@ IT FAILED. Same symptoms as when I first turned it on, the DisplayPort input came to life but never displayed anything.
Okay, reboot with the HDMI. I can't remember whether I disconnected the Thunderbolt the first time or first tried with both the HDMI and Thunderbolt connected. I'm not sure it matters.
Here's where I'm stuck now though. With the Thunderbolt disconnected and the HDMI connected, when I boot I get the distorted image that is attached.
This is apparently my login screen, because I can enter my PIN and something happens. The distorted image changes, but apparently to something with a solid blue background, not the background image I had chosen for my desktop.
If I press enter, that image changes again but I still can't tell anything at all about what is really going on. That's when I gave up and came back here to document my tribulations.

I am so irritated with this thing right now. It really shouldn't be this hard.

LeonWaksman · ‎06-22-2020

Hallo Dave,

I'm confused with the AMD Adrenaline Driver you have installed. According to the SSU report, attached to your post this driver is outdated. The latest Adrenaline driver for NUC8i7HVK is 20.2.2. You may download from this page. Please download it and install.

Leon

DLawr7 · ‎06-22-2020

I'm making a little bit of progress again. I don't know if that banding was just caused by a slightly loose cable or what, but after several reboots my HDMI (onboard GPU) connection was again working well enough for me to see the screen.

Then I discovered something curious when I rebooted yet again with the HDMI disconnected but the Thunderbolt/eGPU/DIsplayPort connected. Even though the screen wasn't showing anything, when I tried to do an orderly shutdown by first entering my PIN (blindly) all of a sudden my desktop showed up. I'm searching for the right words about how to describe this, but basically what I'm seeing is kind of like it still thinks it is doing an extended display. That is, the screen I'm looking at seems to be showing 3440 x 1440, but acting like it is much wider. Moving the mouse pointer to the top edge of screen stops at that boundary as it should, but if I move it to the left , right, or bottom edges, it disappears.

If I try to open Display settings, it opens off the screen and I can't access it. Ditto Device Manager, or even Edge. AMD's Adrenalin opens in the viewable area, but not in a way that appears to be useful to me. This issue of opening programs was pretty much identical to how it behaved when it thought it had two displays to extend together. (This seems to be a failing of Windows independent of my situation. If I've got my mouse over on Display 2 and try to start something, it's fair to assume I want it started on display 2.)

So if I can figure out how to snap the Display settings into view (and I've got some things to try) then maybe I can resolve this issue of where programs open, and maybe that would fix the login screen problem as well.

The struggle continues ...

DLawr7 · ‎06-22-2020

Okay, so I got the Display settings pane on screen by using the Windows Key and Right Arrow until it popped into view. At that point I discovered the core of this problem, a second display that it mysteriously thinks is a ViewSonic Q71-7 attached via Microsoft Basic Display Driver. Maybe this is detritus from when Windows was originally installed by the vendor? It sure isn't any monitor I've ever connected.

So if I selected the monitor connected to the eGPU (identifying as Display 2) then check "Make this my main display", things are basically working, even across reboots, just with the mouse cursor disappearing if I send it over to the phantom monitor. I can't use Duplicate for the display because the resolutions are off then, so I just need to get rid of the phantom monitor. I'm not sure it's a good idea to remove Microsoft Basic Display Driver, so now I'm off to investigate what the best way to ignore it is.

DLawr7 · ‎06-22-2020

Thank you very much for trying to help, LWAKSMAN. That SSU was indeed generated before I had the driver updated. After Sebastian's reply though I did get it updated to the latest.

TDean · ‎06-22-2020

Dlawr7: I just wanted you to know that I have AMD Drivers installed at 20.2.2. For the past year and a half I was using hdmi output to hdmi on my monitor. I got a new computer monitor and have been using displayport and the minor issues I was having were cleared up.

DLawr7 · ‎06-22-2020

Thanks for that update, TDean! As I'm nearing the end of the tunnel, it's clear that it can work. Now I'm just trying to figure out how to get rid of this phantom monitor that can eat the cursor. There are a surprising number of hits out there for "windows 10 phantom monitor"--almost 9 million hits on Google--yet none have led to a solution for me so far. On the one hand I could just ignore it at this point, but I'd like it to be sorted.

Ronny_G_Intel · ‎11-13-2020

Hi everyone,

I dont really have much to add to this post other than we have updated our article: Troubleshooting Tips for eGPU on Intel® NUC but we got nothing regarding Windows 10 Phantom monitors at this point.

I will check internally and will come back to the community if I get anything but it seems to be a broader issue that goes beyond NUC.

Regards,

Ronny G