Skylake hard locks seeminly when IDLE / CStates ON

[GGlyn]

Myself and others have been struggling with a different hard lock problem with Skylake and we have ran out of options but to assume it is a CPU fault/issue. Does anyone have any comments or feedback?

The long thread is over here, but I will summarise. http://www.tomshardware.co.uk/forum/id-2830772/skylake-build-randomly-freezing-crashing/page-7.html New Skylake Build Randomly Freezing/Crashing - Page 7 - windows 10 - Windows 10

Our systems hard lock randomly but appears on the most part to be when IDLE or next to IDLE. The hardlock can come when playing video, browsing (reading) or mostly when not interacting at all. Some (like myself) noted that they seem to occur more often if you are doing a large amount of disk IO (partition move for example or copying 40+ GB of data disk to disk).

Hard locks happen in either Windows (7,8,10) or Linux.

With CStates on, the crashes are often and usually within 10 minutes of IDLE. With CStates disabled completely most find that the system remains "mainly" stable for days. Generally, no one has reported locks when gaming or under high CPU load (so I do not think this is the Prime95 example but then, since compilers / drivers use the latest instructions (according to CPUID) I cant be sure).

The symptoms happen on many different manufacturers motherboards, RAM types and setups. We have successfully removed or replaced all components and the only change that seems to make a difference is CPU for a few. CStates off in the BIOS is absolutely a guarenteed way to stabilize significantly but not fix.

I changed CPU (after trying everything else) and find it now mostly stable with CStates ON. I must be clear that my system is 100% identical, CPU # 1 crashes all the time and must have CStates off, CPU # 2 does not crash so often even with CStates ON. One may argue this is a problem with my PC, a fault, but with so many people having the exact same issues I cant believe it is a defect. And with Cstates/SpeedStep so specifically (a known new part of Skylakes architecture), I remain convinced that this is something real.

Others were not so lucky, a replacement CPU did not make the situation better. Batches from different factories as well etc etc

My new CPU has hard locked but not when IDLE like the last one (not yet anyway). Mine can lock when under full load, video transcoding, but not more than 1 in 10 sessions. Cstates ON seems equally stable on this CPU as OFF.

Thanks for any suggestions you can give.

[JSmit58]

Hello,

I just want to confirm whether I have the same issue as people have experienced or not.

People have started telling it MUST be something from my area that's causing the freeze so either they're right or I have this freezing issue as the rest.

Basically, every few days, my PC freezes in a way that I get a solid color on my screen, sometimes even a glitched screen and evertyhing stops responding (keyboard, mouse, reset button) but the PC is still running (as in, the fans and lights); does this sound like what everyone else is having?

Worth noting that after the latest BIOS, the freezing happens every day, but toggling C states on/off does affect if it happens once or twice a day. I currently disabled EIST and Turbo just to see how much it affects things.

One extra problem which seems to be unique to me is that after I power down the PC, it doesn't boot into BIOS, it just stays in a "sleep" like state where everything is turned on, but there is no display and keyboard/mouse isn't working, and to top it off, I have to wait a few hours until I can actually properly boot it, until then it bots into this "sleep" state. Clearing CMOS and/or removing battery only does things after the Pc properly boots (that is, it resets the BIOS settings).

I plan to try different RAM but I'll wait for another BIOS update first, no point in buying new RAM if it doesn't help.

System:

* i5 6600 (non k)

* Asus Z170m-PLUS

* 2x4 Kingston HyperX Savage 2400 Mhz DDr4

* XFX TS 550w

* Windows 10 (was windows 7, same issues)

[JT8]

Hi,

Having the same problem here... as others mentioned running Prime95/Memtest+/HCI Memtest all worked with no errors running over several hours.

But doing file io/copying, watching videos, browsing would completely freeze my PC randomly and sometimes within few minutes.

Tried Windows10 & Linux (multiple installs) to overrule OS problems, replaced Power supply, ran in IGP mode only, etc.

Thanks to you all, finally came across this thread and have disabled all C-State settings in the BIOS, so far system up and running without a freeze.

Planning to RMA, the CPU and/or MB, a bit confused still as to what the root cause of the problem is.

One other thing I notices most of people posting here seems to have a Gigabyte MB.

System:

* Intel(R) Core(TM) i5-6600 CPU @ 3.30GHz

* Gigabyte H170-D3HP (latest bios F4c)

* 2x8 Kingston HyperX Fury 2400 (Running manual timing of 14-14-14-32 as per SPD for 2133MHz)

* Windows 10 Pro (clean install)

[JT8]

Update: F4 bios for my Gigabyte MB has been running without freezes for the last couple of days..

Strangely the bios release description says "Improve DDR XMP compatibility"... whatever it is I hope this issue fixed for good

[CCris2]

Hi,

Till now I build few PC based on Skylake. they were build on asus and asrock mainboards DDR3/DDR4. None have pc freeze problems ... In my opinion your PC's have some incompatibility or drivers problems.

For example I discovered that on my asrock z170 extreme 7with i7 6700k, if I install asmedia sata ahci drivers the system runs in some serious problems, with random bsod or system locks on black or desktop color.

I have installed all latest drivers but not the asmedia driver and updated not latest bios but a very close to last bios, and my system doesn't have any cstate problems when watching youtube, or movies or even when is not doing anything. Only problem is with Intel igpu as it still has some problems with some applications or games.

For people who are using NVidia video cards, if you update to the latest drivers you may have a lot of problems. It seems latest drivers from NVidia on some systems are buggy giving bsod, or even not booting to OS.

My advise is to test drivers, uninstall one by one and see when your problem disappear, and then test with other (older or newer) version drivers.

[TWalk3]

Having the same issue. Freezing causing a hard boot. Only happens when I'm on idle. Never while gaming or under a heavy load.

Tested RAM, Hard Drives, Graphics card all good.

Just flashed bios and updated bios since I first got the PC. Hasn't froze yet, but seeing some earlier posts are telling me this probably didn't work, but I will keep this updated.

i7 6700k

Gigabyte Z170X Gaming 3

[ZZzha]

Had the same problem: random hard lock while idle or doing light tasks(video streaming, web browsing), no problem under load(games).

It was critical, i could hardly get >1 hour operation without a hard reboot. So i RMA-ed the CPU and do not have a hard lock since the CPU is replaced.

I just write down what i have done, hope this helps to solve your problem

My system with minimum components:

- Intel core i7 6700

- ASUS H170 pro gaming

- Corsair Vengeance LPX DDR4-2133 8Gx2

- Samsung SM951-NVMe 256GB

- Corsair RM650x

- Thermalright Le Grand Macho

I almost tried all the suggestions/theories i can find on the web to confirm the reason:

- mem tests with multiple software tools; different mem slots on MB; different voltage/clock/SPD setups -> no help, and confirmed that mem is ok

- different c-state setups -> no help

- different hard drive -> no help

- different BIOS version -> no help

- different operation systems and drivers -> no help

- PSU is compatible for new c-states and does not have problem under load -> it unlikely causes the problem

So the CPU and MB are left suspicious -> i decided to RMA the parts but TBD to RMA the CPU or the MB or both

I mention the cooler because my cooler is heavy, weights about 900g, and its bracket is originally designed for older platform. There is cooler manufacturer say that the new platform CPU may be damaged if the cooler is too heavy or mounted too tight or even vibrated hardly during transport, because the PCB of the skylake CPU became thiner.

I had already added washers and hope they can lift the cooler and limit the pressure on the CPU, but i could hardly find the threshold. There is people who solve the issue just by reinstall the cooler and i had to take my system apart anyway to RMA the part, so i did an experiment: lose the screws of cooler to reduce the pressure on CPU step by step -> i really had a whole night without single hard lock -> i thought the issue was solved, but the next day the hard locks were back and it did not help to lose the screw further. BUT there was once i touched the cooler and caused instantly a hard lock -> so i decided to RMA the CPU first.

After the new CPU comes, i

- install the cooler with minimum pressure applied, the cooler can now even turn on the CPU.

- add an extra mechanism to hold the cooler, weight of cooler is now lying on the mechanism not on its own bracket.

It has been 2 weeks, no single hard lock happened

My theory:

- My first CPU may be really damaged because of too much pressure set on it.

- If you have already RMA the CPU but did not change/reduce the pressure of cooler, the new one may also be damaged and the issue remains

[TWalk3]

Just an update. Since the R6 for my i7 6700k, Gigabyte gaming 3 mother board update I have had no hard freezes. It's been about 5 days now and no hard freezes. I have had a couple bsod thoiugh. All saying IRQL_NOT_LESS_OR_EQUAL. I think I have found a fix but not 100% sure yet. But I can say for sure after a bios update, I have ran 80% smoother. I would have had a handful of hard locks by now. But I have had no hard locks. I'm not claiming victory yet. I will continue to update the next few weeks. I hope intel and the motherboard companies can fix this issue quick with a bios update.

Thanks,

Shark

[FParr]

Now I have a solution !! :

For anyone who has frostbite while running games and applications system is based on LGA 1151 "Skylake" and uses a XBOX 360 controller or Xbox One; I would even say that even other:

- Do not use CONTROL.

- IF YOU HAVE A DRIVER MICROSOFT XBOX ONE OFFICER, download the latest update FOR CONTROL FROM APP connecting XBOX ACCESSORIES IN A USB 2.0. But again do not use, play with the keyboard.

Simple and easy solution colleagues, apparently this failure is the effect of Windows 10 and its updating.

Here I leave the link that made me check this effect and which might help other users with different fault mode information:

http://www.xatakawindows.com/actualidad-en-redmond/estos-son-los-fallos-que-microsoft-ha-listado-y-corregido-en-la-build-14291-de-windows-10-pc-y-mobile Estos son los fallos que Microsoft ha listado y corregido en la Build 14291 de Windows 10 PC y Mobile

Apparently in the insider Beta Windows they have listed for the next upgrade to Windows 10 launch.

As I said I already have tried and ¡¡ works !!, I tested with one that froze playing with Xbox controller One every 30 minutes and now with keyboard anything.

After I updated the command from the app and I retested, and now freezes are at the same time but much less catastrophic.

Although at the moment until we solve it is a bummer but the theme looks good, we'll see if in the next update corrects this flaw, bug or whatever you call it.

So, could you comment as an information if you work.

What has become clear to me is that my Intel i5 6600K preset working properly, as each of the components of my system, it is a matter of updates.

Greetings.

[dmone2]

congrats! I know you are happy.

[TWalk3]

So just following up now that it has been about a week.

I was having this same issue with i7 6700k with it freezing on idle. Causing a hard boot.

Since flashing my bios and getting the newest update F6, I have had ZERO freezes or hardlocks. But I have had a handful of BSODs. I still haven't found the issue causing the random BSODs, even though I have started to narrow it down. They tend to happen right after logging into my PC. If I make it a few minutes into the desktop everything is usually fine all day. I've went days without a blue screen. Then sometimes I'll get 3 in one day. I think it's related to a faulty driver but I will update this again when I find out what it was.

i7 6700k

Gigabyte Z170X Gaming 3

Gtx 980Ti

Corsair RAM

[FHeik]

You can analyze BSOD's, if memory dump creation is activated in system settings (System > Advanced Settings > Startup & Recovery > Settings > Save Debug Information).

A helpful utility for memory dump analysis can be found http://www.nirsoft.net/utils/blue_screen_view.html here.

[TWalk3]

When I get home in a few hours I will check this out. I believe I just cleaned out my registry so I may have to wait until it gives me another BSOD. But this should definitely help me out. Thank you YseGuy

[ICust66]

I tried upgrading the bios of my Asus Z170 pro gaming, and it froze just the same. It seems to happen mor often when I play games while watching a video on my second monitor.

I disabled the Cstates yesterday so I'll see how it goes, but, god, I am so tired of this. I had this issue for 4 months now! sometimes once a week, sometimes once a month, sometime every day!

I hope a viable solution will emerge soon.

[KTran10]

Contact Intel to return CPU, you have a defective one

[jLisa]

im using gigabyte F6 bios now it is stable i can idle and run many programs now without freezing

[LMonk]

Hello! How many of you have asmedia usb 3.0 controller and did you try to disable it? I found it have major stability issues.

[satas]

hello guys,

I'm having similar issues with my Intel 6600K, 16GB Corsair ram and Asus Z170 ROG VIII Gene.

I thought it was related to the ram and XMP but after a lot of troubleshooting and changing the ram the issue is still there.

in my case it is really very random, it can happen after 1 day or after 10 days but it's never gone completely.

it shows up either as a BSOD (IRQ_NOT_LESS_OR_EQUAL) or a hard lock (freeze) while under almost no load (like just browsing the internet).

all the driver and bios are the latest available.

here is the topic I opened today:

@ lks70

I have the ASMedia USB3.1 controller and I have disabled it in the bios. I'm not really aware of any big impact though.

[AThey]

I too have a i5 6600K on an Asus Z170 A MB with Transcend RAM that runs in all applications and games fine... Problem is freeze/hard lock at idle or when attempting to power downs/sleep. Have tried a Win 10 reinstall, changed PSU (from Seasonic to Corsair), changed RAM (from Corsair to Transcend), have latest MB BIOS, but still freezing...

Have disabled all C States in BIOS and will monitor...

4 months with this problem and if persist, will go back to HASWELL Setup or look at AMD (prepared to take a performance hit for reliability)

[CCris2]

Hi,

It seems that sahafiec had a bent pin on the mainboard CPU socket, so I advise you to check the CPU socket pins with a magnifying lens. Also he said that that Asus CPU mounting system might have something to do with the bent pin and he stopped using it.

[AThey]

Freeze at idle problem not fixed but solved...

Bought a new Gigabyte B150M-DH3 Main Board and new Intel i5 6400... replaced the Asus z170k and Intel i5 6600k...

Same RAM, SSD's, PSU and Nvidia 970 GPU...

Reinstalled Win 10, all software... Running now for more than 5 days, NO FREEZING, blanks monitors, sleeps and awakes no problem...

MB still has original F2 BIOS...

[CCris2]

Theysa

You changed both mainboard and CPU in same time, you don't even know which one was the problem. Well at least it seems that you have it solved.