Laptop doesn't boot with BE200

[Alex6x6x6]

I've installed BE200 to Asus ROG Flow X16 (2022, AMD R9-6900HS) and it bootloops. Installing MT7922 back makes it work as before, but I wanted to get WiFi 7.
Is there anything I can do to make it work?

[Mike_Intel]

Hello Alex6x6x6,

Thank you for posting in Intel community Forum.

For me to further check this inquiry, let me gather the following details first.

1. Did you upgrade the Wireless Card of your laptop?
2. Who installed the wireless card?
3. Can your laptop boot fine if you remove the BE200?

If you have questions, please let us know.

Best regards,

Michael L.

Intel Customer Support Technician

[Alex6x6x6]

1. Yes
2. Me
3. Yes

[cnick6]

Alex, it sounds like a BIOS issue.  You'll need to contact Asus and see if they can/will address it.  Some laptop vendors won't allow random HWIDs from installing.  Some have a 'pre-approved' list and they lock the BIOS to those specific HWIDs.

[Alex6x6x6]

Already did. They told me to f off because it's WiFi 7 card and "laptop specs do not list WiFi 7 support".

I don't believe it's a BIOS lock though: I've tried QCNFA765 and it works just fine. Others tried AX210 and it was also fine.

[cnick6]

Hmm odd.  If the AX210 worked then the BE200 should have worked as well; but I'm guessing they've done something in their BIOS to prevent it.  It's possible you got a bum BE200 card but impossible to know for sure unless you can try it another known-working laptop.

[Alex6x6x6]

At this point I'm leaning towards blaming Intel and their vendor-locking policy. Because, you know, BE200 works fine with Intel CPUs, but not so great with AMD ones. There are many reports of it not working (with same symptoms, actually).
So I'd like to have official answer.

[Mike_Intel]

Hello Alex6x6x6,

Thank you for the reply.

We have discussed this inquiry since you are asking for official statement from Intel.

We want to inform you that the wireless card is not working because of these reasons:

• Manufacturer limitations

• Regulatory issues

• Driver limitations

Some OEMs may restrict the computer to certain wireless adapters, which may result in an installation error when booting with a different wireless adapter that was previously installed. Let me share these articles for more information and also as our official statement:

Why Doesn't My Laptop Recognize My New Intel® Wireless Adapter?: https://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/support/articles/000005846/wireless.html

Regulatory Information Regarding Wireless Hardware Installation or Upgrade: https://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/support/articles/000005687/wireless.html

Frequently Asked Questions about Intel® Wireless Adapters: https://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/support/articles/000006057/wireless/legacy-intel-wireless-products.html

We appreciate your feedback on this that's why we have investigated the issue and upon checking you may need to reach out to your computer manufacturer for further assistance, as some OEMs have limited wireless cards that are compatible with their system.

In the end, it will go down to the compatibility between the system and the wireless card and the compatibility is always dictated by the system.

If you have questions, please let us know.

Best regards,

Michael L.

Intel Customer Support Technician

[Alex6x6x6]

I've tried to contact Asus about this card, but haven't looked into the issue because it's an WiFi 7 card and "it's not in the laptop spec". I've asked about WiFi adapter allowlist and waiting for the reply. But I don't believe it's something they do. Any other card (AX200, AX210, QCNFA765, MT7922) work just fine, so it must be something about BE200. And once again, I've seen reports of it not working in AMD systems with the exact same symptoms.
Don't think it's really about WiFi 7 either, but I'll try to get other adapter and check it.

Can you be more specific about what exactly in BE200 prevents my laptop from booting successfully? So that I could ask Asus to do something about it.

[Alex6x6x6]

Hello,

Asus told me that they don't restrict anything.
Those "reasons" are to vague. Can you be more exact? If it's the driver issue then just fix it. Why (and how) would regulatory issues prevent laptop from booting successfully?

And how convenient that only recent Intel systems are compatible, right? This surely has nothing to do with vendor-locking BE200 to Intel CPUs, right?

So the question remains the same: what's so special about BE200 that my AMD laptop doesn't boot with it (with both Windows and Linux)?

[Mike_Intel]

Hello Alex6x6x6,

Thank you for getting back to us and I understand you reached out to Asus. However, based on our verification of your system specification, we can see that the only supported drivers are MediaTek Wireless (WLAN) & Bluetooth Drivers. If the manufacturer does not have the required approvals, the party installing the device is responsible for approvals. Installing adapters in an unauthorized system may be prohibited. The end user is not allowed to install the Intel® Wireless Adapters. Only the manufacturer or its authorized representative can install the adapters.

If you have already done the integration, it is also important to realize that it may not work due to hardware or software compatibility issues or dependencies.

Intel is a provider of laptop components and does not produce or sell complete laptop systems. Your system manufacturer may have modified the features, added customizations, or made other changes to the software or hardware packaging they offer.

Moreover, we have checked the AX200, AX210, QCNFA765, and MT7922 you provided and they are all Wi-Fi 6/6E. That is why it works fine on your system since it only supports Wi-Fi 6E. Regarding the BE200 (Wi-Fi 7) wireless card and AMD processor, there is no connection and your system should work fine regardless of the wireless card and processor compatibility. The CPU you have does not influence what wifi card you need, you can use the same wifi card with any Intel or AMD CPU. What matters is what port interface the wifi card uses and if your motherboard supports that port, Manufacturer limitations, Regulatory issues, and Driver limitations.

For more information, you can check the specifications of your computer here:

Drivers: https://rog.asus.com/my/laptops/rog-flow/rog-flow-x16-2022-series/helpdesk_download/

Specification: https://rog.asus.com/my/laptops/rog-flow/rog-flow-x16-2022-series/spec/

That is the reason why we suggest you get in touch with Asus to verify everything because according to the specification, it only supports Wi-Fi 6/6E and not Wi-Fi 7

If you have questions, please let us know.

Best regards,

Michael L.

Intel Customer Support Technician

[Alex6x6x6]

Hi,

I've installed Intel Bluetooth and WiFi drivers before trying to use BE200 and removed them afterwards.

> The end user is not allowed to install the Intel® Wireless Adapters
And what's that supposed to mean? That's not a good technical answer to the question I asked.

I'm going to get QCNCM865 (WiFi 7) adapter in few weeks and I'm almost sure it'll work just fine. I'll try it and report back, but this still doesn't answer why BE200 doesn't work.
So what's so different about AX210 and BE200. Please don't tell me that it's WiFi 7 once again. I need a detailed response, not just "driver limitations" (because this is a justification for not properly fixing your driver) or "regulatory limitations" (because WiFi 7 surely works with my router and smartphone) or "manufacturer limitations" (because Intel is the manufacturer of this card, so just lift whatever limitations you have. Seller even added that that card is for Intel systems only, though the same card is being sold on Mouser). And obviously motherboard supports that port (M.2 key E, with at least PCIe and USB).

Is there anything I can do to debug this further (some logs maybe or whatever else)?

[Mike_Intel]

Hello Alex6x6x6,

I really understand your frustration, I really do. However, we do not control the manufacturer/regulatory limitations and even compatibility of the hardware. Intel just produce cards first then the manufacturers will design a system that will support the cards in the market. And this is not applicable to Intel only, this is also applicable to other wifi cards manufacturers.

That is why for clarification with compatibility and to know which card is supported by a laptop or motherboard. The only support who can answer that is always the manufacturer of the laptop and motherboard and not the other way around.

If you have questions, please let us know.

Best regards,

Michael L.

Intel Customer Support Technician

[Alex6x6x6]

Hi,

So you are telling me that Intel who makes these cards (and everything related to them, like unmodifiable drivers and so on) doesn't know what exactly may cause such issue?
Maybe instead of "understanding my frustration" you could've at least tried to answer anything specific? Why even bother having a customer forum then?
Well, great, then this was the last thing I ever bought from Intel. Thanks for you great support.

[Mike_Intel]

Hello Alex6x6x6,

I understand. We will try further research on this matter and post the response on this thread once it is available.

Have a fantastic day, and thank you very much for your patience and understanding!

Best regards,

Michael L.

Intel Customer Support Technician

[Mike_Intel]

Hello Alex6x6x6,

I hope this message finds you well.

We just want to update you that we sent a message on your email as our response to this inquiry.

Thank you, and have a great day ahead!

Best regards,

Michael L.

Intel Customer Support Technician

[Alex6x6x6]

Your email did not contain any new (or even remotely useful for that matter) information. And, besides that, now I got another WiFi 7 card and it works just fine.

So it's only a problem with BE200. Maybe this time you finally say what is so special about BE200 that it refuses to work with AMD CPUs?

[Stepa]

It looks like the Intel BE200 is not compatible with the new AMD chipsets (because the WiFi card is connected to the chipset and not the CPU).

I tested the Intel BE200 with two AMD systems - in one case the system does not turn on (stuck on black screen), in the other the PCIe device is not detected.

As far as I understand, there are two possible problems:

• Intel BE200 may have a non-standard pinout, and the connection of the pins on the motherboard does not allow the network card to work
• Software incompatibility (can be fixed by updating/tweaking the BIOS settings)

[5urg3]

There has been a lot of speculation, but no actual hard facts and evidence around this incompatibility.

For all we know this could be an AMD BIOS bug, and not Intel’s problem.

However the way Intel are handling this and being super vague etc about it is indeed NOT helpful to anyone.

You KNOW there is at least one engineer at Intel that knows exactly what the deal is here, and they’re just not giving that information up to even their own support folks, which is just plain dumb.

For now though, if you have an AMD system, it’s recommended to not use the Intel Wifi7 modules and use the Qualcomm instead.
I am still very interested in the specific root cause of the interoperability issue though.

[Dmit]

Same issue with fresh Lenovo ThinkBook 14 G6+ AHP laptop (AMD cpu).

In my previous Lenovo ThinkBook 15 G5 laptop (AMD also) I successfully changed factory mediatek to intel AX210. And everything work like a charm! Today I did same trick and try new intel BE200 module but laptop just not start even to bios. I am SO disappointed.

[Alex6x6x6]

I ended up getting Qualcomm WCN7851 card and it works just fine.