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INTEL ARC A770 16GB Missing 10Bit Screen Configuration Option

JEMedia
New Contributor I
14,889 Views

Hi,

there is no 10Bit Screen Configuration Option yet.

 

Driver: 31.0.101.4255

Labels (1)
40 Replies
JEMedia
New Contributor I
9,976 Views

To make it clear i am not talking about 10 Bit via HDMI - I have other means to support 10 Bit via HDMI.

 

I am talking about 10Bit Color depth on Monitor via DP for Colour Grading as in other Graphic Drivers like eg NVIDIA.

 

I dont know yet what Intel understands with HDR that is a white field with numerous different possibilities - but I do not need it yet from

INTEL Graphics Card.

MUC
Valued Contributor II
9,956 Views

Please see what was said in the link above.

 

MUC_0-1682275360107.png

JEMedia
New Contributor I
9,926 Views

OK - so my new system with INTEL ARC A770 Graphics Card is unusable for Colour Grading.

I will comunicate that in the Resolve Forum.

 

And use older system with NVIDIA Graphics Card for Color Grading.

Obvously I expected too much from a INTEL Graphics card which I liked much when first installing it.

 

Pls. let me know when the support is added.

 

0 Kudos
Andres_Intel
Employee
9,885 Views

Hello JEMedia,

  

 

Thank you for posting on the Intel®️ communities. I am sorry to hear that you are having color depth issues with your Intel® Arc™ A770 Graphics, I will be happy to help you.  

 

@MUC we appreciate you clarification and you are right. Manually changing the color depth is currently only supported on native HDMI outputs.


There is a workaround for this, and it is the following:


If you are using an Intel® CPU with Integrated Graphics and your motherboard has a native HDMI port, connect the HDMI cable to the HDMI port on the motherboard instead of the one on the Arc GPU. Doing this will result on the Arc GPU handling the rendering of the game or other tasks you use you Arc GPU for, but the display output will be handled by the Integrated Graphics.


For more information, you can access How to Change the Color Depth in the Intel Graphics Command Center when Using Intel® Arc™ Limited Edition Cards.



Regards,  

 

Andres P. 

Intel Customer Support Technician 


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MUC
Valued Contributor II
9,870 Views

That's an interesting option. However, it should be noted that the motherboard must be able to transmit 10 bpc ("bit") to the back panel connector. That is not self-evident. Please also read here:
community.intel.com/t5/Graphics/No-bpc-10-option-in-Graphics-Command-Center/m-p/1465251#M115090

 

Display resolution and refresh rate may be limited by the motherboard manufacturer. Please carefully study their specifications. They can be lower than what the Intel processor itself can do. The spec must say something about "30-bit color" or "30 bpp". 10 bpc applies 30 bits per pixel (bpp). In doubt ask the motherboard manufacturer before buying anything.

If you still want to connect a DisplayPort monitor using this method, then this would be an option (although not ideal):

 

HDMI to DisplayPort 4K120Hz or 8K30Hz M/F Active Adapter

MUC_1-1682447048605.png

JEMedia
New Contributor I
9,822 Views

Yes, its a way to do it via a converter or via the work around of an Intel CPU with IGPU but I do expect the 10Bit support from a professional  discret Graphic Card too.

Unfortunately  my new build of a Professional Video Workstation has a AMD CPU without Graphic.

JEMedia
New Contributor I
9,791 Views

Dear Intel Driver Developer,

when I bougth the Intel ARC A770 I trusted the Thechnical Specs which say DP 2.0.

When looking to the DP 2.0 Specs in Wikipedia you will find attached Specs for color depth.

 

So you, in no means support DP 2.0 - I accept your new driver development but not your statement it will take about 12 Month

to do it.

In a years time it is expected that Battlemage will rech the Market.

 

So your statement of DP 2.0 Support is a fake to me.

 

 

 

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BearBale
New Contributor I
9,466 Views

https://jisakuhibi.jp/review/club3d-cac-1335

 

I have purchased this cable, and using nvidia rtx 3090 TI can not achieve RGB444 10Bit SDR, the same situation also occurs in A770 or A750 LE

You are not an official employee of Intel, can you provide meaningful information when you reply?

Those of us Arc 770or 750 LE graphics card ambassadors have been troubled by the 10Bit SDR problem for a long time

Do you want us to use NVIDIA or AMD graphics cards again and throw Intel graphics cards into the trash?

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MUC
Valued Contributor II
9,769 Views

Unfortunately, these circumstances are beyond the control of either Support Technicians or Developers.

 

I'm not an Intel employee. The following is my personal opinion: Marketing and Project Management want to induce a willingness in consumers to buy. Features are therefore promised. In case of the technology in question, its release is also dependent on certification processes, which the Intel parties involved have little or no influence on. The requirements to meet the VESA Compliance Test Specification (CTS) have recently become increasingly difficult. VESA = Video Electronics Standards Association (https://vesa.org/). The processes for this take ages and no longer correspond to the deadlines that were originally expected by (Intel) Marketing or Project Management. That's why it's unfortunately still the case that Intel Arc graphics cards are offered as: "Designed for DisplayPort 2.0, certification pending VESA CTS Release". So, DisplayPort 2.0 protocol can only be released if VESA approves the matter. And that seems to be delayed.

 

MUC_0-1682622061206.png

 

Nonetheless, the original intent of outputting 10 bpc color depth is not dependent on DisplayPort 2.0. The predecessor DisplayPort 1.4a and all other versions before should support it, as you have read on Wikipedia. In this respect, I am also disappointed that this has not been the case with the Intel DG2/Alchemist graphics cards (without HDR switched on) so far. All Nvidia graphics cards have been able to do this for a very long time. And even older Intel products can do that too. I use a motherboard with an Intel Core i5-10400 with processor integrated Intel UHD630 by myself. This device passes a DisplayPort signal to a Protocol Converter (PCON) on my motherboard, which converts the DisplayPort HBR2 signal into an HDMI 2.0a TMDS signal and transmits it to the back panel HDMI connector. This even works up to 12 bpc color depth. And this despite the fact that UHD630 was introduced in August 2016 (!) and the PCON MCDP2800 in question in July 2018.

 

Obviously, it is not self-evident that existing functions will be available again with the successor product. Incomprehensible, but that's how it is. It only helps to make all the functions that you need transparent before you buy to avoid bad buys and missing interoperability. With computers, this goes down to the level of the cord. Beyond that it’s true for a wide range of makes and models not only in the computer industry. Sometimes it can also happen that certain functions require license costs that a product decision no longer wanted to pay, especially in consumer electronics distributing content that different organizations want to get paid for. In my view, a worrying trend is that car manufacturers, for example, want to conclude subscription contracts with their customers for existing technology. For instance, your seat heating only will work if you pay for it regularly. Although the hardware is always there. I hope that this way of thinking does not prevail. That would no longer have anything to do with sustainability. And where it leads when someone autocratic thinks letting people to pay for things granted for free in the past, you can see on Twitter…

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Andres_Intel
Employee
9,725 Views

Hello JEMedia,

 


Thank you for your response, we appreciate all your comments, that is really helpful. 


We understand your frustration, and for that reason, I will start an investigation of the issue. I will let you know new details as soon as possible.

 


Regards,  


Andres P. 

Intel Customer Support Technician


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duskstalker
Novice
9,656 Views
i wanted to chime in to say that the lack of 10bit color via display port is also something that hurts in my workflow. on Windows Desktop HDR is completely broken and its not great to be stuck with 8 bit only in SDR.

I bought the a770 to replace a radeon vega for my editing and grading PC and so far im really happy with it. but not having the option for 10bit color hurts.

you guys at Intel have come a long way since october. it has been a rough start. i really hope you can offer more options for creators in the gpu space, AMD totally dropped the ball and i dont wanna buy green. i think gaming + creator gpus could be a very good niche for Intel and the a770 is a strong debut here... but it needs a 10bit sdr color depth for editing and color grading.
JEMedia
New Contributor I
9,584 Views

Hi duskstalker,

thanks for your support.

That's exact my position - and my background of this post.

What worries me is a 12 month time to integrate in a discrete professional graphics card which claim DP 2.0 in the technical specs.

Regards

Joe E.

 

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Andres_Intel
Employee
9,576 Views

Hello JEMedia,

 


We were working on the investigation, we are aware of the situation and a solution is being considered but we can't promise any outcome. If you are dissatisfied with the product you can request a refund by contacting Intel Customer Support for reviewing the case.

 

  

Regards,  

 

Andres P. 

Intel Customer Support Technician


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BearBale
New Contributor I
9,446 Views

I just want to know if intel can solve this problem and promise to fix it when? I think ARC PRO series graphics cards also have this problem

If the intel Arc A770 or A750LE graphics card dp and hdmi interface can not modify 10Bit SDR, why should I spend money to buy?

 

Intel official "IntelSupport-Arun" once said on github that it will take 12 months to solve this problem

https://github.com/IGCIT/Intel-GPU-Community-Issue-Tracker-IGCIT/issues/179#issuecomment-1321536731

 

"Due to current workloads, I would like to let you know it might take up to 12 months to complete. However, it will take time, and it is very unlikely it will be available in the next update."

 

Now, you reply us like this

"We were working on the investigation, we are aware of the situation and a solution is being considered but we can't promise any outcome.
If you are dissatisfied with the product you can request a refund by contacting Intel Customer Support for reviewing the case.”

 

In simple words: If this problem can not be solved, and have any comments, please directly request a refund

Why does intel treat us consumers in such a bad way?

 

If I can know in advance that this kind of problem will happen, I would rather continue to use AMD or NVIDIA graphics card! !

Andres_Intel
Employee
9,482 Views

Hello JEMedia,



Were you able to check the previous post?

Let us know if you still need assistance.  

 


Best regards,  


Andres P.  

Intel Customer Support Technician


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BearBale
New Contributor I
9,443 Views

This is the picture when the ARC graphics card was released, but it turned out that even the most basic 10Bit RGB444 SDR function cannot be provided! !

 

Arc_A770_LE_1.jpg

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MUC
Valued Contributor II
9,409 Views

You shouldn't throw away the Intel card if you already have it. This is a driver issue that I think needs to be prioritised by the Intel graphics team.

 

I can provide the following information regarding the protocol conversion (HDMI > DisplayPort) with adapters from my knowledge:

 

  • 4K @ 120 Hz RGB 10-bit is too large for DisplayPort 1.4a and does not fit into the available bandwidth of HBR3 signal transmission. This is independent of SDR or HDR.
  • 4K @ 120 Hz can only be achieved with the YCbCr 4:2:2 color model. Please note that according to the HDMI specification, YCbCr 4:2:2 must always be transmitted using a 12-bit tunnel. Please test if you can set 4K @ 120 Hz YCbCr 4:2:2 with an Nvidia card if ready to hand. If you select 10 bpc, the output will automatically jump to 12 bpc. But not necessarily the setting shown within the Nvidia Control Panel! This can only be seen using a signal analyzer or within the signal diagnostics of the display if implemented. The bandwidth for this signal is 26.73 Gbps on the HDMI site and consequently 100% on the DisplayPort site for DP1.4a HBR3. If this doesn't work, it could also be cable related.
  • The Protocol Converter Club 3D CAC-1335 uses Lontium LT6711GX (HDMI 2.1 FRL5 > DisplayPort 1.4a HBR3)
  • According to the specification, this chip supports 10-bit and Display Stream Compression (DSC pass-through). A DSC encoder for signal forwarding to the DisplayPort site is also implemented. Another product with this chip is, for example, the Delock 64213. However, as with the CAC-1335, DSC is not explicitly mentioned there. This property would have to be requested from the adapter manufacturer or asked why their products do not support what the chip manufacturer says that it should.
  • I can see CRU in BearBale's screenshot. It would be worth testing what happens when you select the "DSC 1.2a" check box: Enable DSC 1.2a and 10 bpc. At least with an Intel Iris Xe (Tiger Lake launched Q1 2021), the support for "All bpp" must also be set to enable DSC. Furthermore it may be necessary to explicitly allow DSC within the Windows registry.  A corresponding transferable guide can be found here. VESA Display Stream Compression (DSC) is part of both standards: DisplayPort 1.4a and HDMI 2.1. It is supported starting with 11th Generation Intel Core Processor Graphics (also known as Tiger Lake) and newer. Don't forget to select an option for "Maximum FRL rate" and "Maximum slices". You can try this:

    MUC_0-1683324146915.png

     

    After the mentioned adjustments in CRU you have to confirm with OK a few times. Then a restart of the graphics driver is necessary. I'd recommend to reboot the computer.
  • "Output Dynamic Range" within the Nvidia driver: Limited = Output Level 16 - 235, this is normal HDMI video range,
    16 being pure black and 235 being pure white. Depending on the signal chain (display engine of the graphics card > protocol converter > cable > display), manual adjustment may be necessary to ensure correct color rendering. This is possible within the Nvidia driver. For Intel devices "Quantization Range" can be chosen as described here: https://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/support/articles/000029572/graphics.html
  • I can confirm from a reliable source that the CAC-1335 is at least capable to operate the AMD Radeon RX 7900 XTX to LG 27GL850 display at a resolution of 2560 × 1440 @144Hz RGB 10-bit (68% bandwidth of HBR3 signaling).
BearBale
New Contributor I
9,397 Views

Have you carefully checked the URL I provided to you?
The CAC-1335 cable used in the display card of the computer can only work at 8Bit color depth

Club 3D CAC-1335 is connected to RTX3090 display card in 4K 60HZ mode, and it can only work at 8Bit color depth

b85b39e0.jpg

 

My monitor is Philips 328P6VUBREB, whether it is using AMD or NVIDIA graphics card, using DP cable can use 4K 60HZ RGB444 10Bit color depth

However, the software "Intel Graphics Control Panel" does not allow users to adjust the color depth from the DP interface. Only the monitor connected with HDMI can be adjusted. Do you know this?

So I bought a CAC-1355, converted Arc A770’s HDMI 2.1 to DP1.4, and then connected it to my screen, but I still can’t use 4K 60HZ RGB444 10Bit color depth

According to the information I know, intel uses the RTD2173 chip on Arc A770&A750LE to convert one of the DP2.0 of the graphics card to HDMI 2.1. This HDMI interface is not native

(Arc a380 is native HDMI 2.1 without any other chip conversion)

If I bought a monitor with HDMI 2.1 interface and used a standard HDMI2.1 cable to connect the monitor to the ARC Arc A770&A750LE graphics card, I couldn’t set the color depth because Intel still couldn’t handle the RTD2173 chip. conversion problem

 

161251xwidbdwolzakzb2i.png

 

The entire series of Arc Pro graphics cards only provide mini DP, but the "Intel Graphics Control Panel" does not allow adjusting the color depth from the DP interface, which is a disaster for professional users! !

I think intel is also because of this problem, until today I haven't seen any reseller selling Arc Pro graphics card

Software limitations, hardware bugs, need to wait 12 months to fix
12 months later, the next-generation Arc graphics card was released

Does intel still care about those of us who bought the first generation of arc graphics card users? i don't think so

"Due to current workloads, I would like to let you know it might take up to 12 months to complete. However, it will take time, and it is very unlikely it will be available in the next update"

Just a blank promise that won't come true, a lie! !

MUC
Valued Contributor II
9,375 Views

Yes, I have read the entire text in your link. Since I assumed you were attributing the 8-bit limitation problem shown at the Nvidia device to the CAC-1335, I just wanted to state my knowledge that the adapter is fundamentally 10-bit capable. So it's probably not the adapter in this environment. 4K @ 60 Hz RGB 10-bit = 20.05 Gbps following CTA-861 HDMI video timing and also fits into DP1.4a with 60% bandwidth demand at HBR3, VESA CVT-RB v2 video timing.

 

Yes, I know that in the Intel Graphics Command Center, the color depth cannot be set manually via the DisplayPort interface. What is almost even more surprising is that the Intel driver does not automatically go to the highest possible color depth reported by the display via EDID. This works very well in conjunction with HDR. Making this possible in SDR must now be a top priority for Intel developers. My comments on restrictions of possible actions of technicians and developers only referred to DisplayPort 2.0 UHBR signaling. Not on 10-bit capability with DP1.4a.

 

Andres_Intel's suggestion with the HDMI workaround referred to use ports of processor-integrated graphics only. I'm sorry if you misunderstood this.

 

The Arc HDMI interface is not native, that is correct. The RTD2173 is used as a protocol converter. The A380 does not provide HDMI 2.1 Fixed Rate Link (FRL) but only HDMI 2.1 Transition-minimized differential signaling (TMDS). This corresponds to the "old" HDMI 2.0, but according to the specifications of the HDMI Licensing Administrator, it may no longer be called and marketed as such.

 

I agree that bit depth output constraint is a very painful proposition. This should be corrected as soon as possible. The hardware itself can certainly do that.

 

As far as I know, Intel is not currently considering selling the Arc Pro individually. Only in pre-configured workstations. Matrox recently announced Intel based cards aiming at the same range of use: https://video.matrox.com/en/products/graphics-cards/luma-series

 

Inevitably, Intel also caters to those who bought first. The Xe Display Engine uses generic drivers (common platform) that must work with all products. Advantage: If an error is fixed, everyone gets the fix. Disadvantage: It takes a long time because the test width is much higher. Another disadvantage: If an error is accidentally installed, all products will also get this error.

 

Please note that the statement about the 1 year duration was made in November 2022. There are "only" 6 months left until November 2023. Maybe the bugfix can be accelerated and it will be available in 3 months. But that's just a personal guess.

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