Development Tool EPM7256AETC

[REngel]

Hello,

we have an old design with a Altera EPM7256AES. As we learned now, we have to support this design for extended periods. The original design was made with Max+Plus II V6.0 and was untouched for over 10 years.

The question for me is now: is it possible to get a license for that old Max+Plus II version or is it possible to get and use a newer Software (Quartus) and then which version? 

Thanks

Ray

[AR_A_Intel]

Hello

Welcome to INTEL forum. The EPM7256AES belongs to the MAX 7000 CPLD family. Per my understanding, programming is possible with any version of Quartus programmer. The latest Quartus version supporting compilation for MAX7000S is 13.1, and a free lite version is still available for download.

https://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/collections/products/fpga/software/downloads.html?s=Newest&f:guidetmD240C377263B4C70A4EA0E452D0182CA=%5BQuartus%C2%AE%20II%20Software%5D

[_AK6DN_ · Accepted solution]

Actually not quite true. The 13.1 version of QuartusII does NOT support the MAX7000 family in any form.

You need to use the 13.0sp1 version of QuartusII, which is the last version that supports the MAX3000/7000 CPLD families.

Get it here:

https://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/software-kit/711791/intel-quartus-ii-web-edition-design-software-version-13-0sp1-for-windows.html

Available for either Windows or Linux. I use the Windows version on Windows 10 Pro 64b, it works fine.

I develop in verilog for the MAX7nnnS series parts and it works just fine.

The MAX7nnnAE variation is also supported.

The free/unlicensed web version works just fine for this application.

[REngel]

Hello,

thank you for the quick reply. The version 13-0sp1 seems to work without problems.

Best regards

Ray

[FredcwGO_BR]

Would you happen to have the schematics for that board?

[JMACDUDE]

I'm using Quartus 13.0.1 but it doesn't seem to support EPM7256ATC series or the MAX 7000A at all.  Is the a device support pakage available?

[AR_A_Intel]

Thanks for update answer @_AK6DN_. You could also refer here https://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/support/programmable/support-resources/design-software/devices-support.html#intel%C2%AEmax%C2%AEseries for Intel® Quartus® Software Latest Version for Device Support.

We haven't received a response from you, and I trust that our previous message has clarified any concerns or confusion. I'll now transfer this conversation to community support. If you have any new inquiries, feel free to initiate a new thread for assistance from Intel experts. Otherwise, community members are available to support you in this ongoing discussion. Thank you.

[_AK6DN_]

I will point out the cited web page:

https://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/support/programmable/support-resources/design-software/devices-support.html#intel%C2%AEmax%C2%AEseries

has incorrect info / a typo for the last column for the MAX 7000 / 3000A series parts.

It calls out version 13.1sp1 which actually does not exist. The entry should be 13.0sp1 as it is in the previous column.

So you should update your web page as it is providing incorrect info.

[JMACDUDE]

I have a similar issue.  I must support older designs using the EPM7256.  We bought EPM7256ATC100-7 I.C.s and installed them into our circuit boards.  We are using Quartus 13.01 and select EPM7256AETC100-10 device (3.3v) since that's the closed to the ATC device we installed.  Since I can't find ANY information on the EPM7256ATC device I hope that works.

So how compatible is the AETC and the ATC series?

I have selected the EPM7256AETC -100, since its the closes I can find to the EMP7256ATC-100 we are using.  It builds fine. 

So assuming that they are compatible that brings up my biggest issue - programming the device. 

The problem is that the Quartus II Programmer has no selection for the ATC device and when I select an AE is fails the blank check.

If I perform an Auto Detect t it shows up as a EPM7256S (5volt) device.  But then my build using the AETC is not compatible with to 7256S and there is no EPM7256xxx-100 device available to compile for.

Do I need to update the programmer or get device support for the 7256ATC device? 

[_AK6DN_]

I have nothing but negative news re: the EPM7256A vs EPM7256AE.

I have QuartusII 13.0sp1 installed and it supports the AE series, not the A series.

I have QuartusII 6.1 and 9.1sp2 also available, and they both support both the A and AE series for DEVELOPMENT.

With respect to programming, however, the A series is NOT selectable. Just the AE series.

From the Altera MAX7000A/AE datasheet Sept 2003 v4.5, this comment on p.16:

The JTAG ID's for the EPM7128A vs EPM7128AE are different. Same difference applies to EPM7256A vs EPM7256AE.

So altho you can select the A series for development in QuartusII 6.1 or 9.1sp2, you CANNOT select the A series for programming.

Only the AE series parts show up in the programmer device selector.

My suggestion at this point would be to dump the A series parts and look for AE series equivalents.
Possibly the EPM3256A might be an alternative. The EPM7256AE certainly is.

There may be other versions of Quartus between 6.1, 9.1sp2, and 13.0sp1 (like 11.0 or 12.0) that handle the A series,
but I can't say as I don't have those versions installed and available. The release notes for QuartusII 2.1 mention support
for the 7xxxAE and 3xxxA series but nothing for the 7xxxA series. This is going all the way back to 2002.

[JMACDUDE]

Thanks AK6DN,

You are correct sir, that is bad news.

I guess I can buy the ICs, build programs, but not actually use them.

I'm going to try using one of my old Max PlusII programs but my USB Blaster won't work so I'm buying a ByteBlaster(MV) and may yet save my boards.

I wonder if Intel/Altera would have a solution to using the EPM7256ATC100 in 2024? 

Thanks for the info

John

[_AK6DN_]

"I wonder if Intel/Altera would have a solution to using the EPM7256ATC100 in 2024? "

As a direct fit/form/function compatible device? I highly doubt it. They are moving upscale and not interested in the low end.

There are lower end devices in the MAX5/MAX10 family that would probably be acceptable alternatives.

But they will all require a board/footprint redesign. No devices that would just drop in.

[JMACDUDE]

I guess that brings me to the next issue.  I actually designed the PCB for EPM7256AETC100, but was only able to buy ATC chips from my normal vendors.

The Compiler supports EPM7256 AETC, AETI chips and it seems I can buy these and replace the ones on the PCB

However the programmer only supports EPM7256AE and EPM7256AET100

I can't find the difference between these suffixes in the 7000A data sheets.

If I replace the ATC chips with either AETI or  AETC chips will I be able to program them with using the  quartus programmer set to AE or AET?

Thanks

[JMACDUDE]

Just another note - I was never able to find anything in the Max7000A data sheet about the EPM7256ATC variety ether.

Is it the same pin out?  And is there any way to program it?

[JMACDUDE]

Final note.  I'm getting some EPM7256AETC100‑10 chips to replace the ATC ones install in the the PCBs.

Quartus 13.0.1 can build it but I'm gambling that the programmer can program the AETC.

The programmer lists the AE and AET but not AETC.

If anyone knows if Quartus can or can't program the AETC please let me know.

Thanks

John

[_AK6DN_]

It should work. The programmer does not care about temperature range (I or C) or speed grade (5, 7, 10, etc).

The generated .pof files can be programmed into any temperature or speed grade of a device, as the die is identical.

The programmer only cares about the die EPM7256AE and the package type T100 for TQFP-100.

So any of EPM7256AETC100-10, EPM7256AETI100-10, EPM7256AETC100-15, EPM7256AETI100-15, etc

should all program from the same .pof file under the generic EPM7256AET100 category.

On the compilation/development side that generates the .pof file, Quartus wants the temp grade and speed grade

to be able to do accurate logic synthesis and timing analysis. In the end the .pof file is temp grade and speed grade

independent, so as I noted above it can be programmed into any speed of temp grade of the die/package combo.

[JMACDUDE]

Thanks, I really appreciate it.

The next rev will be something with a future.   I don't use much more than 256 or 320 cells and the new intel stuff is pretty huge, plus I'm haven't used any BGA's yet.

This CASE IS CLOSED!

John