Thermal sensor issue i7-7700k?

[CK7]

I have a brand new build; EVERYTHING NEW. i7-7700k is running at stock speeds. I have the RAM set to XMP for DDR4-2666. Motherboard is Asus Maximus IX Hero Z270.

I have found that the i7-7700k reports a momentary (a second or less) temperature spike +25 > 35 degrees Celsius anytime a program is opened, a webpage is opened, a background app runs etc. The temperature blip cascades through the cores in random order; not the same every time. This causes my heatsink fan to constantly cycle up and down. Temperatures otherwise report as steady, normal increases. Peak temperature under Prime95 blend test is 71 degrees Celsius.

Attempted solutions:

I have re-installed my heatsink and thermal paste with no change.

I have tried to manually set my fan speed in the bios. The only setting that avoids this issue is setting the temperature / fan at a constant (and loud) 80-100%. I've tried PWM and DC mode.

I have found a few user reports elsewhere on the web, all reasoning that it's just the way it is. I don't accept that. Opening a folder or browser should not spike temps +30 degrees. Not only is the fan cycling annoying, it puts undue stress on my fan; possibly shortening its lifespan.

What's the answer, if any? RMA?

[AElib]

Hi.

sorry for the late replay, have been busy at work.

1 - You are a rich person to change the CPU after 2 months of use.

not really, the thing is that i have two jobs, the main one is good paid and the second one is to pay for my Hobby ( Hadwares )

2 - Besides the difference between 6700k and 7700k is not too big.

you are right but the 7700K Overclock way better than the 6700K, my ex 6700K needed 1.36v for 4.6GHz and my 7700K need just 1.31V for 5.0GHz.

3 - Have you sold your 6700k?

yes i sold it on Ebay 2 days after i got the 7700K

ra5040

Were you talking about a custom Watercooling or AIO?

[idata]

Hi Intel,

A few weeks ago I bought a Lenovo Legion 520 with a i7-7700HQ.

At times, the processor package temperature spikes over 80 grad Celsius for a second or tow and drops down after the fan kicks in.

My measurements are with the Intel Extreme Tuning Utility.

I don't use any overclocking or custom tuning whatsoever.

My Ram default speed is 2133 MHz according to this tool.

I'm worried that this isn't normal behavior and there will be problems with my CPU/Laptop.

Any feedback or idea is welcome.

[ASušt]

"I'm worried"

Intel is not.

Sorry for unhelpful comment.

Most of us hear that fan noise.

[idata]

Hi Links

Is there anything I/we can do?

My box is brand new and Lenovo. So it isn't something I assembled.

Thanks

[ASušt]

I think you can try adjusting the fan curve in your BIOS settings (if it's possible).

Try putting a delay before fan ramp up or change the temp at which fan goes up.

[TGrab1]

240+ mm AIOs are generally better than air solutions, but the highest end air coolers can come pretty close. Those same air coolers have enough mass and surface area they are pretty quiet too. So when looking at the entry level AIO and high end air it is pretty much a wash in terms of price/performance.

However once you get into higher end AIOs they are to pull away and will also come with more quiet fans etc. I guess my point is there are a lot of factors that come in to play when trying to find the best solution. If you do your research and read a few reviews on the product you should be fine.

I went with an expandable AIO when I started out and it was actually very nice and easily expanded when i added gpu's to the loop. That being said I prefer water cooling because it doesn't put a huge amount of weight on my board which makes it have a chance of breaking.

I will warn you though... once you go water and get the bug you will find yourself trying to build a custom loop :-D.

[ASušt]

I'm near living with cat in a carboard box with this PC! >_<

So, can I coulnt BeQuiet Silent Loop 280mm as high end.

No Custom loops please!

[AElib]

will warn you though... once you go water and get the bug you will find yourself trying to build a custom loop :-D.

Nice advice :-)

Links

Build one and you will have a lot of fun ;-)

[ASušt]

Thanx for the advice, but I want to have a lot of calmness.

All this story is getting prety long. And it's about time to put an end to this!

Guys, what do you think. If intel refunds me and I go 6700k, will the spiky situation get better? Am I right, that 6700k is the closes to 7700k in terms of performance on the same LGA??

OR

Should I take a risk, buy an AIO and hope that CPU will not overheat? (i really think i won't...that's a 400w ~200W TDP @ low fan speeds AIO, seriously)

Would be good to delid, but I'm afraid)

[AElib]

I have already told you that the 6700K it never had any kind of spikes issue, i don't know where you read it or who told you that.

If Intel refunds you go for the 6700K.

[ASušt]

Sorry, can't find the thread now.

Can I use my RAM @ 3600nhz with 6700k?

[AElib]

What board do you have?

[ASušt]

Asus Maximus iX Formula

Z270 chipset.

[SRozo]

don't know what you're talking about. it does have same spikes as 7700k goes from 25 to straight 40 when all cores at 40multi and from 25 to 60 when 45multi applied.

the only thing that comes on my mind that you're using constant voltage.

[VGil]

The processor 7700k incorrect readings from the temperature sensors. I measured the temperature with a pyrometer. The temperature on the thermometer was in the drain 37-38 degrees Celsius. The utility was showing 66 degrees Celsius. People do not believe the testimony of the utilities. They are not true. Intel admits his errors in some series 7700k. To admit a mistake means to return the majority of processors from the market, and this is a blow to the image and budget of the company Intel. I repeat: the temperature sensors show false readings. Check the thermometer. After scalping, the situation has not changed, as were the spikes, so they stayed.

[TGrab1]

VadimGil wrote:

The processor 7700k incorrect readings from the temperature sensors. I measured the temperature with a pyrometer. The temperature on the thermometer was in the drain 37-38 degrees Celsius. The utility was showing 66 degrees Celsius. People do not believe the testimony of the utilities. They are not true. Intel admits his errors in some series 7700k. To admit a mistake means to return the majority of processors from the market, and this is a blow to the image and budget of the company Intel. I repeat: the temperature sensors show false readings. Check the thermometer. After scalping, the situation has not changed, as were the spikes, so they stayed.

This could be explained by the fact you are getting a reading either from the base of your cooler or from your IHS. The temp of the DIE is much hotter than either of those. This is also why people are seeing such big drops when delidding. The TIM being used doesn't do the best job of transferring the heat to the IHS and then to the block. So this is easily explained.

I don't see this being a sensor issue on 99.9% of samples. You will have defects and some chips will have faulty sensors, but I do not see that being the issue here.

[idata]

I would really appreciate it if some of you could try this out for me.

I've just replaced my ASUS motherboard because I was having a voltage issue with it. Here is a n OCCT test which shows the problem:

The settings are Manual with CPU Core Voltage Override set to 1.320v; LLC Level 5 (which is mid-way from off to maximum). As you can see, at idle the voltage is shown as 1.313 volts, dropping to 1.297 volts, which is probably normal Vdroop. Under load the voltage is solid at 1.297v, except for the blips down to 1.281v (or a drop of 16mv). These drops mean that I have to set the Core Voltage Override up by 16mv, as the blips can cause instability. This means that I end up with a higher voltage and higher temperatures for a particular clock rate, which in turn limits my overclocking potential.

The new motherboard is significantly better, in that there are fewer blips, but otherwise it is exactly the same: Vdroop to a steady voltage, but with exactly the same 16mv drops:

The other difference with this board is that the 1.320v setting gives an idle Vcore of 1.329v, whereas the old board gave a Vcore of 1.313v. I used the same BIOS settings exactly (I saved the old ones and restored them to the new board). I'm not sure if this points to poor voltage regulators on the boards, or to inaccurate sensors (probably the latter).

I would really very much appreciate it if you could do a test like this one, with a manual voltage setting and a mid-value LLC, run OCCT and see if you too are getting these voltage drops. If so they will also be affecting your overclocking potential and/or heat.

Cheers

Robert

[TGrab1]

Hi Robert,

So without going to deep into this post. The idle Volts being higher than your setting is a side effect of LLC.

So for example you were running manual at 1.3 with LLC off. Your idle would be really close to 1.3, but when under heavy use you would see bigger drops because of Vdroop maybe 1.25

As you turn up LLC it tries to counteract Vdroop and also smooth out your voltage. So at a high level your Idle might be 1.315 your average usage might be 1.3 and your heavy use might drop to 1.293

Basically LLC is just trying to tighten up the curve and keep Vdroop down. It can help it getting your overall voltage down which helps on temps as Vdroop will not be as sever at one end of the spectrum, but then again turning it to high can create higher than wanted volts at other parts of the spectrum.

I would give the following article a quick read:

http://www.masterslair.com/vdroop-and-load-line-calibration-is-vdroop-really-bad Vdroop and Load Line Calibration: Is Vdroop Really Bad?

[idata]

Thanks ...

I had read the article you mention. To summarise my understanding:

When the CPU load changes suddenly there will be ringing on the voltage rail. This can be substantial and the peaks may exceed the maximum that the CPU can tolerate. To make sure that this does not happen, Intel introduced Vdroop, which effectively reduces the voltage by the peak ringing amount. So if the peak ringing is 50mv and the Vin is 3.050v, the Vdroop circuitry will reduce the voltage so that Vcore is 3.000v (or perhaps lower).

A second factor comes into play, which has nothing to do with Vdroop: and that is that when the load increases, the voltage may drop if the voltage regulator is unable to supply the voltage. So under load the 3.00v may drop to 2.900v, say.

None of this should result in sudden voltage blips that I'm seeing, I don't think. Look at this test result:

LLC is disabled in this case (or as disabled as I know how to on my Prime Z270-A). I have the voltage set to 1.330v. Vcore at idle is 1.312v, which is the 18mv Vdroop compensation, I expect. The voltage varies between 1.328 and 1.296, which is presumably OCCT detecting the ringing. So that looks fine.

Then, at the extreme right, the OCCT test starts and the voltage drops to 1.248, which is a 60mv drop. As you can see this causes the test to fail.

This is either due to a very poor voltage regulator or some other fault: the voltage shouldn't drop by so much (I don't think).

Here is the result of another test which show the blips I mentioned:

In this case I have the voltage at 1.328v and LLC at level 5. The Idle voltage under test goes from 1.313 to 1.329, so this is almost perfect (assuming of course that OCCT catches the peaks and the sensors are accurate). Voltage drop under load is well controlled (as it should be ... after all a good low-pass filter + load compensation circuitry should be able to handle that). What is not OK, to my mind, are the blips down to 1.296. These should be there whenever there's a load change if they are ringing, or they shouldn't be there at all.

I have tried all the LLC settings and all of them show the same negative blips. I do have this issue with ASUS, but they have been pretty useless so far: basically, saying that these are not normal and I should replace the board or buy a more expensive one. That is why I was hoping one of you guys would try a similar test on your board to see if you are also getting these blips.

Cheers

Robert

[TGrab1]

I will give it a go tonight when I get home. I have just been swamped at work. The wannacry worm is causing havoc all over the darn place.

[idata]

Thanks T ... there's no rush at all as I'm away for 3 weeks (holiday/photoshoot in Corsica ). BTW, I also had C States and speedtest disabled so that I could see the voltages more clearly.

I'll let you know what ASUS comes back with ... I'll keep plugging away at that end too.

Cheers

Robert