How best proceed with overheating i7-4790K?

[REnso1]

I have an i7-4790K in a GA-Z97MX Gaming 5 mobo latest F4 BIOS.

I used a Noctua NH-L12 cooler rated at 95W for cooling the processor rated at 88W in a Lian Li PC V354 with 4 fans, 2 in 2 out, case closed and case open, ambient is 27-30°C.

Temperatures in BIOS and memtest86+ were high so I decided to try stress testing and in Prime95 small FFT cores 1&2 overheated to 100°C using Core Temp.

I tried reseating the heatsink and renewing the NT-H1 TIM and opening the case but it made no difference. I have a photo of the contact pattern here.

When I tested using the OCCT benchmark I was unable to complete a test due to the processor overheating so I underclocked the processor to 3.6 GHz, disabled turbo and manually set vCore to 1.1v.

With an underclocked processor I was able to get a heating and cooling curve using the OCCT auto capture, to enable me to study the problem.

Even when underclocked the processor was reaching high temperatures, rapid fluctuations in temperature with work load suggest a bottleneck in the thermal pathway. When I tested with the intel retail cooler which came with the CPU the cooling was much less effective than the NH-L12 (even when underclocked taking just over a minute of OCCT to reach the 85°C cut off point see below) indicating the NH-L12 was doing a good job of removing heat, which meant the processor was making the heat or the source of the bottleneck.

I have discussed it http://forums.hexus.net/cpus/327593-4790k-overheating-nh-l12.html elsewhere. Advice was to contact Intel due to an absence of information relating to my retailer's testing procedures. I have asked about these but am still waiting for a reply.

So my question is how should I proceed from here? Does this qualify for an RMA? If so is it possible to negotiate this with Intel direct or do I have to go through my retailer?

I have done my best to make sure I am not doing anything wrong and I would be grateful for any pointers to any mistakes I may be making.

[SPark48]

This is really not the thread for it, but I'm sure there are a bunch of threads out there of why adaptive vcore is preferred over static. Most of the benefits of adaptive vcore we already discussed, such as making sure your CPU is getting sufficient power only when it needs it. Supposedly, adaptive vcore can also extend the longevity of your chip since when it is not under load, your CPU won't be getting unnecessary voltage. For example, let's say I am on stock settings (x44 multiplier), and in adaptive mode, my vcore goes from 1.04 on idle and 1.22 under 100% stress. If I set my vcore to 1.15, then 1) my CPU is getting more voltage than needed when idle (thus shortening lifespan, ever so slightly), and 2) it's not getting enough voltage when under stress (possibly unstable system with BSOD). You keep mentioning your benchmark scores when you said you don't really care for them, but let's discuss that for a second. You had a score of 1113 when static and 1106 adaptive, so a difference of 7... First of all, a benchmark difference of 7 won't be felt AT ALL in real-world situations, so it's not like your wife's video editing will improve even by 1 second by getting a better benchmark score of 7. Second, I bet if you ran the benchmark 10 times, you'll get a different benchmark score all 10 times, so in essence a score of 1113 and 1106 is exactly the same in my book. Once again, this is YOUR computer that you bought with YOUR money, so you can do what you want. I'm just telling you what I would do with my computer that I paid good money for.

"When I had 1.150, XMP, and LLC Extreme, I was at all 4 cores 44x, and had a temp of 65 in the stress test, 71 in benchmark with 1113 score."

- If that's what you were getting at those settings, then go with those settings. My understanding was that you were having problems with those settings. No throttling, no BSOD, no other problems? If this is the case, then again... why are we having this conversation???

[jhill15]

Man, read my very long post describing how to deal with throttling, keep your cores at 4.4ghz, and keep temps from going astronomical on you... it's very clearly written above.

[JMahr]

Ken,

I sent you the pictures earlier in the thread about my CPU overheating. Please give me a reply as soon as possible. Seems that I should just RMA but wanted your answer first.

Thanks,

Joshwaa

[SPark48]

Joshwaa,

When he responds to you, please ask Ken why Intel charges their customers $25 to ship back an RMA when it is not our fault that the processor is overheating. We did not make them, their engineers did. They should be charging $25 to their engineers and not to us. We already paid for the processor and we're expecting it to work correctly when we buy it, but if it doesn't work the way it was intended to, then why is that our fault? As mentioned before, RMA at Google and Apple are completely free to the customer if the device is not working right.

[KenF_Intel]

Hi Joshwaa,

I've searched for the pictures you posted, but can't find them. Can you point me in the right direction?

Thanks.

[JMahr]

It is in the post right after you asked for them. Post # 324

As it states keep in mind the temps are with a good aftermarket cooler.

[KenF_Intel]

Thanks Joshwaa. Wish I knew why that didn't come up when I searched for posts from you.

The decision on whether or not to process an RMA is up to you. I'm sure you understand that no processor will work correctly if the motherboard settings are incorrect, so you could easily be in the same position after the RMA.

I think you might need to tweak the setting for Core Voltage. I know 1.10v caused BSOD's. Perhaps your motherboard needs a different setting. Leaving it at "default" means you are using what ever voltage your mobo maker chose, and that has not been working out for most folks on this thread.

[JMahr]

I now have the processor in a new Z97 Gaming 7 mobo which set all the setting correctly and still getting the high temps. Also could you clarify someone earlier in the thread said you charge for an RMA? I have never heard of anything like that which is why I ask. Thanks

[KenF_Intel]

Hi Joshwaa,

RMA = Return Material Authorization. It's another way of saying Warranty Request.

It's interesting that you say the Gaming 7 automatically set the proper voltages. Many folks have had issues with that board. What BIOS version do you have?

[JMahr]

It came with 1.50 which were correct settings. I updated to 1.70 and the settings were also correct. Btw this is the MSI Z97 Gaming 7 not the Gigabyte. I had horrible luck with a lot of there boards during the P45 and P67 era and will not go back to them.

Is there a charge for the RMA?

[jband2]

RigItPC wich is the new lote of the processor??

[DVu3]

My batch number is L429C229. Even in the same batch, there are good and bad CPUs. I got two in the same batch. One is extremely hot (85 - 94C even without Turbo Boost), while the other one is much cooler. Just keep trying your luck until you got the good one (if you can).

[DVu3]

My computation jobs peak at 60C with Turbo Boost on and run continuously at 4.2GHz, no throttling. So much better! It's worth an RMA or exchange with the retail store where you bought the CPU if yours is overheating.

[GFigg]

I'm hoping to get some good help here. I see that there's been a lot of discussion on heating issues with the I7-4790k. I've been trying to follow the thread as much as I can, but 27 pages of information is difficult to sift through.

I'll start by listing my hardware:

Processor: I7-4790k (obviously) batch L436C878, stock fan

Motherboard: Gigabyte G1.Sniper Z97 (F6)

Memory: G.Skill Ripjaws X 4GBx4

Windows 7 Pro

Case: Coolermaster HAF 932

I first started noticing that there might be a problem when I learned my computer was shutting down unexpectedly over night. That's what brought me to this thread.

After reading up on a few things I was able to adjust some settings using the Intel XTU and in the BIOS to what I thought might stabilize things, but a mid-session BSOD while playing Skyrim blew that theory out of the water. So below are some shots I took that may help you determine where my issues lie. If you need additional information, please let me know and I'll be happy to provide. (Sorry for the poor quality of the images)

As you can see, while in the BIOS the CPU is idling around 37C. But XTU shows it idling around 50C while in the OS. It's been a long time since I've built a PC, but I know that this is bad. Please help!

[WMisi]

Hi guys, i'd like to share my own experience with overheating 4790k.

Ater mounting brand new Gigabyte z97x gaming 5 with 4790k i ran occt and realized that temps might be too high. It was like 85-88 °C.

It was the same with a longer crysis 3 session.

I've got Silentium aftermarket cooler and Arctic silver thermal paste.

I was pretty sure i applied paste properly, but tried to remount HSF with new paste.

I cleaned both cpu lid and HS plate but this time applied only tiny layer of paste.

What i've seen was pretty similar to this : (this is not my system, found on the net)

Although HS plate was perfectly flat, CPU LID wasn't... After i switched thermal paste to more "liquid", cheap one delivered with HSF,

I've got now max 76 °C with OOCT and other tests. I am not decided yet, if i am going to polish this CPU or try to change to another with my retailer.

Anyway try to make such a simple test if You have trouble with overheating cpu's. It migh be as well, that after exchange some of You that reported that it helped,

might just get more flat CPU from stock.

And here interesting article:

http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/coolers/display/core-i7-coolers-roundup_16.html# sect0 Prolimatech Megahalems and 12 Other Coolers for Intel Core i7 Overclocking. Page 16 - X-bit labs

Regards

[SPark48]

LosGrak,

It's hard to say what caused the BSOD and random shutdowns with the information you presented. Your settings all seem OK, but 50C at idle is much higher than average. Of course load temperatures are more important, but usually (for desktop computers at least) higher idle temperatures = higher load temperatures. What are your temperatures like at full load? Have you done any stress testing using XTU or a 3rd party software like Prime95 or AIDA64? Try running these to see if your computer is shutting itself down to prevent damage from hot temperatures. Also, download and run the Intel Processor Diagnostic Tool to see if you're failing that. Given the high idle temperatures, I would highly suggest making sure the heatsink and fan are indeed installed correctly. In my experience, most of the time high idle temperatures are from incorrect heatsink/CPU fan/thermal paste installation.

Good luck!

[GFigg]

With everything at defaults (BIOS and XTU), this is what it looks like at rest:

I stepped away for a few minutes and found that my system had restarted. After log in I was greeted with:

"Windows has recovered from an unexpected shut down"

Problem signature:

Problem Event Name: BlueScreen

OS Version: 6.1.7601.2.1.0.256.48

Locale ID: 1033

Additional information about the problem:

BCCode: 124

BCP1: 0000000000000000

BCP2: FFFFFA80102DB028

BCP3: 00000000BF800000

BCP4: 0000000000200401

OS Version: 6_1_7601

Service Pack: 1_0

Product: 256_1

Event log shows:

I then ran IPDT with the above settings, as suggested. It says the processor passed, though XTU reported temps up to 100C near the end, and throttling up to 23%.

I then changed settings in XTU to those listed earlier in the thread (no change to CPU VCore in BIOS, which is reporting 1.248v), rebooted and ran IPDT again:

It never cracked 75C and had no throttling. However, I'm almost sure that it's going to BSOD or give me an unexpected shut down again if I just let it sit over night.

I have ordered a new fan and heatsink that I hope will help, but I honestly don't know what's causing the crashes. If the new parts don't help I have until 12/27 to RMA the CPU and hope for better luck on the next one.

[DVu3]

From your first picture, I saw that you set the 4 cores ratio at 44X, this would raise the core temp a lot (at least 1.29V with default BIOS), so that probably was the reason why your PC reset. In the last picture, it was set at 42X, so that lower both the voltage and heat so it peaked at ~75C (Intel Max Temp 74.14C).

[BAbre]

Hello

I have this system:

-Motherboard Asus Maximus VII Hero

-CPU Intel Core i7-4790K 4GHz 8MB Sk1150

-Water Cooling Corsair Hydro Series H100i

-GPU Asus GTX980-4GD5

-Memory Kingston HyperX Savage DDR3-2400MHz 2x8GB

-PSU Corsair RM750W

-SSD Samsung 2.5" 850 Pro 512GB

-SSD Crucial MX100 256GB

-HD Western Digital Passport Essential SE 2TB USB3

-Case Obsidian 550D

-Sound card Asus Xonar Essence STX II 7.1

-Monitor Asus 27" 144Hz VG278HE

My room temp is 14ºC (57.2ºF).

The air cooling in my case is set like this:

-1 stock Corsair Case fan, on the front, in air intake

-1 Noctua NF-S12A Case Fan, on the front, in air intake

-1 Noctua NF-S12A Case Fan, on the back, in air exhaust

-1 stock Corsair Case fan, on the bottom, in air intake

-Water Cooler Corsair H100i, on the top of the case, in air exhaust

The termal paste used on my CPU to mount the water cooler was Artic Silver 5.

I had 37º C (98.6 º F) on iddle,

(v core always on 1.25V, on iddle, with default settings. I don't know why. SpeedStep is enabled on bios.)

76º C (168º F) was my full load temp, using Intel XTU Stress Test.

Then I saw ken-intel thread,

And made the manual changes as describred in his screenshots, on Intel XTU,

The temps I have now are these:

36ºC (96.8ºF) on iddle,

(CPU Core Voltage always on 1.15V, does not go down, even on iddle, still don't know why.)

64ºC (147.2ºF) on full load, using Intel XTU,

(Processor Frequency went to 4.4ghz before, now It only goes to 4.2ghz max)

My friend's config with the same CPU, Motherboard and Memmory:

-Intel Core i7-4790K 4GHz 8MB Sk1150

-Kingston HyperX Savage DDR3-2400MHz 2x8GB

-Motherboard Asus Z97 Maximus VII Hero

-PSU Corsair Builder CX750W

-Case Carbide 200R (CC-9011023-WW)

-Water Cooler Corsair Hydro Series H80i

-SSD Crucial MX100 256GB

-GPU MSI GTX970 Gaming 4G

Very similar to my desktop, but with,

-Water Cooler Corsair H80i, instead of my H100i

-2 stock case fans, 1 in front, in intake and another on the back of the case, in air exhaust. I have 4.

-Case Corsair Carbide 200R. Mine is Corsair Obsidian 550D.

My system should have better temps than his, but it does not.

He has:

25ºC (77ºF) on iddle,

54ºC (129.2ºF) on Full Load, using the same Intel XTU program, with same CPU, Motherboard and Memmory.

I have a few questions,

-Why is my CPU Core Voltage always on 1.15V even on iddle? How can I change this? SpeedStep is enabled on BIOS.

-Before my CPU Processor Frequency went to 4.4ghz. How can I make it go to that level on full load again, without raising temps too much?

-Finally, what do you think of my CPU temps? Are they good?

-What should be the reason for my friend's temps, with the same CPU, Motherboard, Memmory, be 11ºC (51.8ºF) lower on iddle, and 10ºC (50ºF) lower on full load? (he has stock thermal paste)

-Are there any changes I can manually make for my motherboard Asus Maximus VII Hero, on Intel XTU, that could give me better temps?

Best reggards,

Bernas

[LM_]

1. Normally you can change this in the BIOS settings. My voltage is on 1.10, which is also near the minimum I think.

2. You need to change all multipliers in XTU to 44. (this means that each core works with 4,4 GHz if all four are used. If you have set it to standard then you have 42, which means 4,2 GHz if all four are used).

3. There could be more than one reason. Maybe his pump of the cooler works faster; you have XMP activated and he not (this also makes out 10° on full load); maybe his fans are set higher on full load etc. etc.

XMP can be deactivated in the BIOS and the fans/cooler can be edited with a programm for the motherboard (for example for MSI motherboards it's the MSI Command Center) or some cooler even get a software with it. Install it and you should be able to edit the functions.

If all of this doesn't work you can try to change the thermal paste. You can read about my hardware and temperatures the third post above yours.

[SPark48]

Bernas,

First of all, I have both the ASUS Maximus VII Gene and Formula and they both have had the 4790K in them at one point so my setup is pretty similar to yours. In fact, even the way you have your fans set up is pretty similar to how my Formula machine is set up. I do have a couple of suggestions on improving temperatures.

1) On your H100i, are your fans set up in push-pull? So 4 fans, 2 on each side? If you haven't done this yet, I would highly suggest doing it. I also recommend using the SP120 (static pressure fans from Corsair) for the 4 fans. I don't have the screenshots to back it up, but I saw 8C-10C drops in my idle and load temperatures from just replacing the 2 stock fans that came with my H105 with 4 SP120 fans. I seriously thought that the claims made by Corsair on the SP vs AF fans were just hype and gimmick, but I went with the 4 SP120 fans just to improve the aesthetic of my machine (the red rings to match the interior). However, I'm a believer now and have since changed all my radiator fans in all machines to the SP series. I would get you screenshots, but it would just be a big hassle for me to change everything to stock and back. If anything, even if you don't get the 8C-10C drop, you will at least improve the way your computer looks if you change to the SP120.

2) Arctic Silver 5 is a GREAT thermal paste. I use them for almost every one of my builds where an aftermarket cooler is requested. However, IC Diamond is better, IMO. It is a bit on the expensive side, so I only use it on builds I intend to keep and use myself. But I have seen 1C-2C drops switching from Arctic Silver 5 to IC Diamond (after burn-in period). It's not much, but when it comes to CPU temperatures, every little bit helps, especially on these 4790K's. Beware though, that applying the IC Diamond is quite different from other applications. The viscosity of the paste is VERY thick and for sure you're not going to want to do the "press, lift, then press again" method that some suggest. Go to their website and skim through their install instructions first before doing the application.

As for your questions, as a disclaimer: I'm just an amateur builder; my career is in the medical field, but I build custom computers as a hobby for my office, family, friends, and word of mouth. So by no means am I an expert on this stuff. I will answer your questions to the best of my knowledge and have other people more knowledgeable correct me where I am wrong.

-Why is my CPU Core Voltage always on 1.15V even on iddle? How can I change this? SpeedStep is enabled on BIOS.

-- From what I understand, something new to the Haswell chips is a build in voltage regulator in the CPU itself. Due to this addition, the BIOS has difficulties regulating the voltage. To have your CPU "adapt" to the needed voltage, you will have to use the "Dynamic CPU Voltage Offset" in Intel XTU. It looks like you already have the voltage set to "Adaptive" mode, so that's where it needs to be. Try changing the offset to 0.05 mV and see what that does.

-Before my CPU Processor Frequency went to 4.4ghz. How can I make it go to that level on full load again, without raising temps too much?

-- For just about every other motherboard, the stock BIOS settings will set CPU Cores 1, 2, 3, and 4 at x44, x44, x43, x42, respectively. However, for the ROG motherboards, the BIOS will set all 4 cores at x44, hence the reason you were getting 4.4GHz. The problem is, decreasing the Processor Current Limit to 105 (as suggested by Ken) will limit the CPU to run at max of 4.2GHz. To fix this issue, I increased the Processor Current Limit to 161.5 (any less than that and my CPU started to throttle) and I was able to get back to 4.4GHz. Obviously this did raise my temps, but not by much.

-Finally, what do you think of my CPU temps? Are they good?

-- Your temperatures are fine. But as I've been saying repeatedly on this thread, what concerns me is that many owners of the 4790K here are "content" to keep their CPUs at stock due to the high temperatures. A lot of people are saying "I'm getting ~70C at stock so I'm happy with that". The problem with this is that the "K" processors are meant to overclock, otherwise why buy a K processor? Just buy a 4790 and be happy with it. You pay $40-$50 more for the K processor so you can overclock it, right? So, if you're getting 70C's at stock settings, that means you don't have very much wiggle room to overclock the processor. Conversely, I have a machine with a i5 4690K and at stock, max temperatures were low 50C's. I was able to overclock the 4690K from stock of 3.5GHz to a stable 4.6GHz and still have temperatures in low 70C's. With the temperatures of the 4790K's being this high at stock settings, you really can't do much to play around with it. (As stated in previous post, I was able to RMA my first overheating 4790K and the second one I received has been much better. I have now overclocked the 4790K to 4.9GHz, stable.)

-What should be the reason for my friend's temps, with the same CPU, Motherboard, Memory, be 11ºC (51.8ºF) lower on idle, and 10ºC (50ºF) lower on full load? (he has stock thermal paste)

-- There are so many other variables to consider than just CPU, MB, memory. First of all, every CPU is different, even within the same model. Second, don't underestimate the stock thermal paste on the Corsair coolers. I know it doesn't look like anything special, but their stock thermal paste is actually really good. Also, not to question you in any way, but when it comes to applying thermal paste and installing the waterblock onto CPU, there is always human error to consider. I can't count the number of times I had high temperatures and just re-applying paste and re-seating waterblock brought temperatures to normal. Even things like air turbulence in your computer case, room temperatures, fan controller settings, all have a hand in your reported CPU temperatures. Try the suggestions I gave above and I'm sure you'll see improved temperatures.

-Are there any changes I can manually make for my motherboard Asus Maximus VII Hero, on Intel XTU, that could give me better temps?

-- As for manual changes, I took Ken's suggestions and actually went into the BIOS and made the changes. I'm sure changing CPU settings with XTU is perfectly fine, but I'm just much more comfortable with making the changes in BIOS. It just feels more... Permanent? Reliable? For me, using Ken's settings and applying them in BIOS (with exception of Processor Current Limit to 161.5 instead of 105) has given me significant improvements to the point where was able to overclock to 4.9GHz.

I hope this helps you out!