XTU: Applying *any* change causes cold boot instabilities

[TimurB]

Hello.

On my undervolted Z790 + 13900K system I just reproduced over two dozens instant cold-boot crashes (no BSOD, sometimes clearing BIOS settings) starting a Cinebench 23 benchmark loop at realtime priority. This seems to be caused by XTU.

The instability is not (!) based on my (BIOS) CPU settings, but on Intel XTU changing anything about them, even when slower values are used or when values are just set back and forth. I compared CPU values via HWinfo before and after hitting Apply in XTU after going back and forth on a value, but could not detect any differences. So whatever XTU does is rather hidden.

Based on the severity of the instabilities I assume something about voltages being messed up despite XTU claiming not to touch those when a VF curve is used in BIOS. It does not change the VF points, though, because these are still listed as unchanged in HWinfo. 

Doing a clean installation of an older XTU version did not help. I do not see voltage differences via HWinfo between before vs. after applying XTU changes. The cold reboot only happens using CB23 at Realtime priority, not Normal or High.

(PS: I only use XTU to workaround a BIOS bug where AVX ratios are set before Core ratios after extended shutdown and thus need two boot-ups every morning to be properly set based on non stock Core ratios.)

[TimurB]

Turns out that my supposed workaround of stopping/restarting the service isn't viable. When the XTU service is stopped/restarted then it doesn't apply its settings on next restart anymore (aka resets everything as if an error had occurred). So a real fix would be appreciated.

[Mike_Intel]

Hello TimurB,

Thank you for patiently waiting for our update.

Base on our recent checking of the issue. It looks like because of workload and application type Cinebench is using it in real-time mode takes over almost all CPU time, having everything almost stop.

XTU service still need some of CPU time to perform changes and monitor situation.

So, as previously mentioned - we don't recommend using Cinebench or other benchmarks in real-time mode as it was mentioned in many articles.

Thank you so much for informing us about this situation and just take note on the usage of real-time priority for apps.

If you have questions, please let us know. Thank you.

Best regards,

Michael L.

Intel Customer Support Technician

[TimurB]

Ok, I see that Intel has no interest in supporting their (overclocking) application properly and I am played for a fool.

Not only did I repeatedly mention that *restarting the XTU service fixes the crashes* despite running the *same workload*, I also told you the crashes happen *without using CB23 in realtime priority*! The latter is just an easy and 100% working way to reproduce the instabilities within 3 seconds instead of having to wait for them to happen randomly.

I also know that other users experience the same hard crashes with XTU and that the software seems to be rather unpopular in the overclocking community due to its lack of reliability.

Meanwhile I switched to Throttlestop to set my AVX ratios properly, something I only have to do in software because the (Gigabyte) BIOS does not set them properly to begin with. Another point where Intel had shown to put too little interest in what mainboard manufacturers where doing until 13/14th gen instabilities reached a level that could not be denied anymore.

Michael, thanks for looking into this for some time, but unfortunately your back-office left you hanging with no solution.

Best regards and try harder Intel!

[Mike_Intel]

Hello TimurB,

Thank you for the update.

We understand your situation that is why we also would like to further investigate this issue.

We hope that you can still share the following details that our Engineering team would like to know.

1. Please share a step by step guide or recorded reproduction/video of the issue.
2. Please add screenshot of task manager CPU tab, so we can see CPU status before Cinebench will start.

If you have questions, please let us know. Thank you.

Best regards,

Michael L.

Intel Customer Support Technician

[TimurB]

1. 

a) Change/increase the AVX offset in XTU (or any other parameter from what I can tell).

b) Click Apply in XTU.

c) Start Cinebench 23.

d) Set Cinebench 23' process priority to "Realtime" (!this is for easy reproduction of the error!).

e) Start Cinebench 23' "Multi-core" benchmark.

-> Hard "cold boot" crash, sometimes with "BIOS error" message (BIOS reset to defaults).

Repeat the same steps, but this time *restart* (or stop) the XtuOcDriverService before step e).

-> No crash.

2. 

It's noteworthy that this also happens when I use either full stock BIOS settings or stock + Intel "stability specs" settings (AC LL = DC LL, 125 PL1, 253 W PL2, 307 A ICCmax, TVB 70°C).

Have a nice weekend!

[Mike_Intel]

Hello TimurB,

Thank you for the information provided.  

We will do further research on this matter and post the response on this thread once it is available.

Have a fantastic day, and thank you very much for your patience and understanding!

Best regards,

Michael L.

Intel Customer Support Technician