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Hardware Design

MATRIX7878
New Contributor I
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Hello,

 

     I am building my own FPGA board as I cannot find one that has all the abilities that I desire.  I want to use an Agilex 7 M-Series (specifically the AGMF039R47A1E1V).  I cannot find all the CAD files that I can import into Alitum.  I have all the peripherals on the board, but no controller or hookups.  Where can I find said files so I can know how to connect the FPGA?  Also, is there a document about how to wire it up with power (e.g. how should I do the power rails)?  Once I get the design done, I will need to code the drivers for my peripherals.  I am using DDR5 (x2), PCIe x16 Gen 5 (x1), M.2 NVMe (x1), HDMI (x1) and DisplayPort (x1).  I know the examples will be in Verilog, but I need hardware design files to describe hookups.  I also want to use a JHL8540 S RH4Q (Thunderbolt 4) chip and am trying to get a premier account.  Where can I find hookups and standard board design help for my PCB?

 

Thank you,

 

Drew

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_AK6DN_
Valued Contributor I
1,340 Views

"I need someone who can tell me the target impedance for the peripherals I am using"

That depends on the signalling technology used. Some lines will be LVDS or SSTL or HSTL and may require explicit
single ended or differential impedance with termination (either internally terminated or external termination resistors).

Simple LVCMOS OR LVTTL lines don't require any explicit impedance characteristic.

Your peripheral datasheet will provide such info as to any expected impedance control on interface lines.

 

"I have not found a datasheet that says what capacitors I need on power pins, or things of the similar nature."

No real datasheet will be that explicit. You are expected to design a power supply that provides the required
steady state voltage and current, and dynamic current, to keep the power supply rails within tolerance. It is up
to you to chose the values and types of capacitors (both capacitance and ESR) to meet those goals.

The power distribution worksheets that Intel supplies are a start but just that. Only a start.

 

"I do not want to have someone build it for me. I want to learn and build it myself. I need to learn."

What you built before was a go kart. Pretty simple and very forgiving. Now you want to build a Tesla.

I suspect your ESP32 project was a pretty simple 2 or 4 layer board.

I suspect using your target AGMF039R47A1E1V device (which has something like 4500 pins...) will require a 24-32 layer board.

I have built boards in the past with 4000 pin ASICs and we used 28 layer stackups to breakout all the signals and power planes.

 

Just for yucks I googled the part AGMF039R47A1E1V and came up with the following document from CERN.

I don't know what kind of resources or team you have to develop your design. I hope it is not just you.

 

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11 Replies
Farabi
Employee
1,424 Views

Hello,


You can refer to all documentation from this link : https://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/products/details/fpga/agilex.html


regards,

Farabi


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MATRIX7878
New Contributor I
1,411 Views

Hello,

 

     I do not know what that link is to do for me.  I want to build my own board and do not know where to find all the documentation is for me to do that in my CAD software.  Is there something more?

 

Thank you,

 

Drew

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NurAiman_M_Intel
Employee
1,383 Views

Hi,


Sorry to tell you that we does not provide support to CAD software. However, we can provide you the Cadence Capture CIS schematic symbol: https://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/content-details/758875/cadence-capture-cis-schematic-symbol-for-agmf039-r47a-package.html


You can get the board resource from here:

https://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/products/details/fpga/development-kits/agilex/agm039.html


Apologize for the inconveniences.


Regards,

Aiman




MATRIX7878
New Contributor I
1,369 Views

Hello,

 

     If I wanted to know the needed width of tracks for a corresponding feature, Intel could not support that?  Or if I needed to ensure I was wiring things correctly, Intel could not do that for me?  That is understandable, but still disappointing.

 

     This does help me as a start, but there are certainly more that I will need to have in order to create the board I want.

 

Thank you for this start,

 

Drew

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_AK6DN_
Valued Contributor I
1,357 Views

You are expecting way more help from a user support forum than is reasonable.

It appears to me you need the help of an experienced board design engineer that knows how to do what you are asking.

'PCB trace width' depends on what you are trying to achieve (eg. controlled impedance trace of a particular target Zo?)
and will largely depend on your PCB stackup and material choices. That is not something Intel can provide for you.

Given the data sheet you have all the information you need to build schematic and footprint symbols for a CAD application.
Intel supplies some symbols for a mainstream commercial CAD system (Cadence Allegro) but obviously can't provide those
files for every CAD system out there. You need to learn how to build these yourself.

Have you ever designed and laid out a complex board before? From the questions you ask my impression is not.

My advice is to either find a development board that gets close to what you want. Or else find an experienced design engineer.

MATRIX7878
New Contributor I
1,345 Views

Yes, perhaps I am expecting too much, I will not deny that.

 

I do not need an experienced board engineer; I need someone who can tell me the target impedance for the peripherals I am using.  I can figure out track width, but I need to know impedance.

 

I have not found a datasheet that says what capacitors I need on power pins, or things of the similar nature.  Then I need to find datasheets for the I/O I have and build those too.

 

The most complex board I have designed is a ESP32 board.

 

I cannot find a development board that I want.  I have already checked.  Hence why I am making my own.  I do not want to have someone build it for me.  I want to learn and build it myself.  I need to learn.

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_AK6DN_
Valued Contributor I
1,341 Views

"I need someone who can tell me the target impedance for the peripherals I am using"

That depends on the signalling technology used. Some lines will be LVDS or SSTL or HSTL and may require explicit
single ended or differential impedance with termination (either internally terminated or external termination resistors).

Simple LVCMOS OR LVTTL lines don't require any explicit impedance characteristic.

Your peripheral datasheet will provide such info as to any expected impedance control on interface lines.

 

"I have not found a datasheet that says what capacitors I need on power pins, or things of the similar nature."

No real datasheet will be that explicit. You are expected to design a power supply that provides the required
steady state voltage and current, and dynamic current, to keep the power supply rails within tolerance. It is up
to you to chose the values and types of capacitors (both capacitance and ESR) to meet those goals.

The power distribution worksheets that Intel supplies are a start but just that. Only a start.

 

"I do not want to have someone build it for me. I want to learn and build it myself. I need to learn."

What you built before was a go kart. Pretty simple and very forgiving. Now you want to build a Tesla.

I suspect your ESP32 project was a pretty simple 2 or 4 layer board.

I suspect using your target AGMF039R47A1E1V device (which has something like 4500 pins...) will require a 24-32 layer board.

I have built boards in the past with 4000 pin ASICs and we used 28 layer stackups to breakout all the signals and power planes.

 

Just for yucks I googled the part AGMF039R47A1E1V and came up with the following document from CERN.

I don't know what kind of resources or team you have to develop your design. I hope it is not just you.

 

MATRIX7878
New Contributor I
1,318 Views

I would like to agree with you, but there are no real datasheets for DDR, HDMI, DP, M.2 NVMe and PCIe.  At least none that have a definitive definition of what to use.  They seem to be a closely guarded secret.  Perhaps though there are places that they do exist.

 

I have to build the power system itself, there is nothing that can give me a bare minimum?  Is there at least a way I can find out the min and max range of power system?

 

That...is probably the best analogy you could have used.  It was a simple 6-layer board, but yes, you have a valid point.  From what I have seen about the boards, I always thought that it was around 8 layers.  Maybe those are smaller ones though.

 

CERN?  As in the super collider?  Or is there another CERN?  It is just me and my only resource is Google.  I have no major team; I am just a solo engineer.

 

I appreciate your help very much.

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NurAiman_M_Intel
Employee
1,300 Views

Hi,


This our only support for CAD.


I am not sure what do you mean by power system, is it power supply?

For power management userguide, you can refer below:

https://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/docs/programmable/683373/current/power-management-overview.html


Agilex 7 pinout files:

https://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/support/programmable/support-resources/devices/lit-dp.html


MATRIX7878
New Contributor I
1,251 Views

Hello,

 

     By power I mean how to hook up the power circuit.  What goes between the power plane and the power pins.  I see though that it is up to me.

 

Thank you for the pinout files.

 

Thank you for the help.

 

Drew

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NurAiman_M_Intel
Employee
1,236 Views

I now transition this thread to community support. If you have a new question, feel free to open a new thread to get the support from Intel experts. Otherwise, the community users will continue to help you on this thread. Thank you.


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